This isn't about protecting anyone's rights. This is the attempt to enshrine Christian privilege in law. There isn't much of anything that cannot be justified in the name of religion, and this decision would open the door to a very slippery slope.
I’m suspecting this won’t be the open and shut case some folks expect of the SCROTUS.
On the one hand, this is about Christian privilege and expanding it. Something the SCROTUS is wont to do in the majority of its decisions.
On the other hand, this is also about corporate control. Sure this case is a government entity, but the effects will be felt across the corporate world. Putting burdens on businesses is about the only thing the corrupt in our government will actually stand up to on principle. Their owner donors won’t stand for it, and if Clarence Thomas doesn’t get his luxury vacation he gets mighty grumpy.
So, I am going to bet on SCROTUS making the right decision for all the wrong reasons. Unless they can carve out exceptions for government vs. private corporations, then all bets are off.
There's also the fact that the defendant, Louis DeJoy, is an arch-conservative himself. I'm not sure how comfy they'd feel ruling against a Trump appointee.
Nah, when Christians took the Old Testament they also took ownership of the parts of Judaism they liked. And since they own them they can do what they want with them, sabbath is Sunday, Yahweh is about love, Satan is the bad guy, all kinds of crazy stuff!
Oh no, I would never suggest such a thing. I'm quite certain that all christians are pious, holy, and keep all of Jeezy-boy's commands. They all love evreyone and treat them with respect, and they never ever do anything to their neighbor's cost or detriment Now... Wanna buy a bridge? 😈
Do you charge admission? I'm supposed to see that in less than a month. (only have a day and a half, still trying to figure out what I want to see in the Castro while I'm there)
For my online friends, admission is free unless you want to drive from the north end to San Francisco. And then, God has commanded me to charge you $10.
If you have a problem with that, take it up with God. I hear he responds admirably well to prayer.
I’ve long thought that the networks and football orgs have been missing out by not having a separate channel that mostly shows the cheerleaders and only occasionally cuts away to a football play. As there are usually several games being played simultaneously, the Cheerleader Channel could jump around amongst the various scantily clad cheerleader groups.
OT : grocery delivery, we were putting the food away and found an expensive bottle of Champagne. First time something we didn't order find it's way in one of our bags.
In my youth, we used to go to a vineyard run by a – I suspect alcoholic – Yugoslavian guy who would sell stuff to anyone. Sherry was incredibly sweet and incredibly cheap, so for approximately 25 cents you could get a half-gallon. I drank two thirds of it, had a glass of someone else's port, and spent a couple of hours walking round at 2 o'clock in the morning being sick over every lamppost I came across. Can't stand the smell of sherry to this day. Hardly drink these days anyway. When you get as old as I am a couple of drinks is often hangover territory.
I've never had groceries delivered, but one day I found a large carton of half pound packs of butter on my front doorstep. Never found out who put it there or why. I rang the cops and their somewhat panicky reply was "We don't want it!". No help there. Eventually I just gave it away.
We're a small office and people will regularly bring stuff in for everyone to share. We are trying to be a little healthier, so lately it's been more fruit and such. Someone recently brought in a big bowl of Chex Mix. WHO PUTS M&M'S IN CHEX MIX?!?
Same here. I brought pie on pi day for everyone. We get cake for birthdays, I always ask for ice cream treats instead because A) they’re delicious, and B) they last for weeks.
And this is how the US turns into a theocracy, slowly and through the courts. Unless there is a serious backlash in the voting booths that's where we're going. FFS, we need to get rid of the electoral college.
I’m late to the party and haven’t read the 252 comments but….when someone takes a job that is specifically about covering holidays and weekends, should they be surprised when they are told to report on a weekend day?
The job started as a no-Sunday-delivery job. Then they got a new contract which included Sunday deliveries, but the PO used their other workforce to cover all those shifts (their attempt at reasonable accommodation). Then due to a combination of personnel issues - people leaving, one person broke their leg, etc - this reasonable accommodation became impossible, which is when they asked him to cover it.
Abuse always has consequences, always has blowback.
If this case opens the floodgates of religious privilege as described here, non-religious employees will suffer, employers will suffer, businesses will suffer and even fail, and people who depend on the goods and services of those failed businesses will suffer. Society in general will begin to resent religious people in general, because they're causing hardship for everyone else. They will enjoy their privileges for a while, but it will be less and less enjoyable to be religious because they will be more and more unpopular. Being religious will no longer be considered a virtue. It will be seen as a sign of selfishness. Young people won't want to be associated with anything resembling religion. Yet again, religion will be accelerating its ongoing extinction.
The irony here is that religious employees who demand generous accommodations such as being absent on Sundays depend on non-religious people to fill in for them. Meanwhile, they're also trying to convert non-religious people to their religion. If enough newly-converted employees make the same demands, the company will fail and everybody will be out of work.
That certainly is supported by the latest polls showing significant declines in religion, especially in the youngest folks, where many point to the hateful behavior of the religious and churches motivating the shift. I'll feel we've finally abandoned medieval thinking when believers are seen as little better than pariahs. The next few years are gonna be way too interesting with a lot more setbacks to come.
Why are Christians like Groff such freaking crybabies?
When I was stationed in Bien Hoa AB in Vietnam (the biggest hot spot for Agent Orange. Not just in 'Nam but arguably the entire world), I worked 12-hour graveyard shifts with 9 days on and one day off. When I did a TDY to Tan Son Nhut AB in Saigon, I worked 12-hour day shifts with 12 days on and 1 day off. This where the daytime temps reached 120 degrees F (nighttime was less hot, but not a whole lot cooler)
We really need to start discriminating against conservative Christians like they think we already do. Then maybe they'll actually be brought down to a level playing field.
Christians with their mouths closed? Inconceivable!
Notice how Christians in America talk about persecution in this country yet avoid travelling to other countries to stand with their brethren who truly are being persecuted? They're way too comfortable and hate being even being mildly inconvenienced.
Christians, who have this allegedly awesome god in their corner, still seem to have no problem whining about absolutely everything not going their way....and even when it does.
They don't even have to be racist. Though it probably helps. These things have completely cured my desire to be a door-to-door encyclopaedia salesman in the US.
I was going to make a Furturama reference about robot lawyers (even though the most famous one is a chicken), but it turns out that lawbots are a thing.
Groff tried to make a claim under the Americans with Disabilities Act but couldn't meet the test because a Delusion, by its medical definition, excludes religious beliefs. Hence, Christianity cannot be claimed as a Disease.
Two comments - As President Jackson said when the Supreme Court ruled removing the Cherokee Indians from Georgia was unconstitutional, "Let them enforce it." In the same vein, let SCOTUS enforce the new USPS rules. The other comment is that this whole Christian privilege argument will blow up when a business refuses to serve anyone wearing a Christian cross or an employee refuses to work with someone for the same reason.
Well, SCROTUS is really good at hypocrisy and making a ruling apply when they want it and not apply when they don’t. They will have no problem enforcing this case, punishing the employer for not accommodating his religious request but at the same time punishing a non-Christian employee who is perceived to be stepping on a Christian in the same way.
Well said. I once wrote a column exposing what the Good News Club really does. One person replied "Whats the problem? All the GNC is doing is bringing kids to jesus. I replied if he was OK with that he would be OK if another group wanted to bring kids to Allah. He said that was a different story. Why? Our task is to help Christian zelots think through their demands. Should another religion become dominate in America, they will want religious privelege too. I can hear the Christian zelots crying that the religious privlege laws they passed was only meant for Christians.
Some of them have already cried it. I've herd more than one christian apologist claim the Constitution only applies to christians, and even that only christians should be citizens.
This isn't about protecting anyone's rights. This is the attempt to enshrine Christian privilege in law. There isn't much of anything that cannot be justified in the name of religion, and this decision would open the door to a very slippery slope.
𝑇ℎ𝑖𝑠 𝑖𝑠𝑛'𝑡 𝑎𝑏𝑜𝑢𝑡 𝑝𝑟𝑜𝑡𝑒𝑐𝑡𝑖𝑛𝑔 𝑎𝑛𝑦𝑜𝑛𝑒'𝑠 𝑟𝑖𝑔ℎ𝑡𝑠. 𝑇ℎ𝑖𝑠 𝑖𝑠 𝑡ℎ𝑒 𝑎𝑡𝑡𝑒𝑚𝑝𝑡 𝑡𝑜 𝑒𝑛𝑠ℎ𝑟𝑖𝑛𝑒 𝐶ℎ𝑟𝑖𝑠𝑡𝑖𝑎𝑛 𝑝𝑟𝑖𝑣𝑖𝑙𝑒𝑔𝑒 𝑖𝑛 𝑙𝑎𝑤.
𝗧𝗛𝗜𝗦!!!
And it's exactly why I won't be surprised when SCOTUS hands the win to the christers.
But SCOTUS is also very pro business, so this could go either way.
I’m suspecting this won’t be the open and shut case some folks expect of the SCROTUS.
On the one hand, this is about Christian privilege and expanding it. Something the SCROTUS is wont to do in the majority of its decisions.
On the other hand, this is also about corporate control. Sure this case is a government entity, but the effects will be felt across the corporate world. Putting burdens on businesses is about the only thing the corrupt in our government will actually stand up to on principle. Their owner donors won’t stand for it, and if Clarence Thomas doesn’t get his luxury vacation he gets mighty grumpy.
So, I am going to bet on SCROTUS making the right decision for all the wrong reasons. Unless they can carve out exceptions for government vs. private corporations, then all bets are off.
Wait, we've been seeing Thomas *not* grumpy? Good lord, he'll kill us all if he doesn't get his vacation!
There's also the fact that the defendant, Louis DeJoy, is an arch-conservative himself. I'm not sure how comfy they'd feel ruling against a Trump appointee.
It depends. Did Uncle Thomas get to ride on his yacht?
Can't work on Sunday? Get a job at Chick-fil-A.
I wonder what it would be like if someone was watching Groff and noted that he went shopping on Sunday.
Or using his car/starting a fire/cook... Sorry I was misled by the word Sabbath.
Which is Saturday, not Sunday.
Nah, when Christians took the Old Testament they also took ownership of the parts of Judaism they liked. And since they own them they can do what they want with them, sabbath is Sunday, Yahweh is about love, Satan is the bad guy, all kinds of crazy stuff!
You mean the Judeo part.😇
Yup. Friday night to Saturday night.
Bet this guy enjoys his Friday and Saturday nights.
Which is why he needs Sundays off.
🥃🍸🍺🍷 = 😵🤢🤮
I wonder if overusing the toilet bowl due to the excesses of Friday and Saturday nights counts as working on the Sabbath.
Well, he's probably in the bathroom a lot every day. Oh wait, you said "working," not "wanking." I really need new glasses.
It depends if the person concerned have to pick up the toilet paper roll or not.
My point exactly. Either he is a christian or not. Doesn't one of judges on the sc is Jewish ?
Elena Kagan
He's got that covered. He strung a string around the shopping center.
Oops, my bad, wrong group of religious fanatics.
Or sitting at home, drinking beer and watching football, getting off on all the cheerleading bimbos.
Do you mean to say that he's a drunkard per Corinthians, end of married, committing adultery, per jeebus?
Oh no, I would never suggest such a thing. I'm quite certain that all christians are pious, holy, and keep all of Jeezy-boy's commands. They all love evreyone and treat them with respect, and they never ever do anything to their neighbor's cost or detriment Now... Wanna buy a bridge? 😈
Damn. I just bought a big orange one last week. It's pretty neat. Maybe next time.
Do you charge admission? I'm supposed to see that in less than a month. (only have a day and a half, still trying to figure out what I want to see in the Castro while I'm there)
For my online friends, admission is free unless you want to drive from the north end to San Francisco. And then, God has commanded me to charge you $10.
If you have a problem with that, take it up with God. I hear he responds admirably well to prayer.
You don't want a bridge. You want beachfront property in Arizona.
“getting off on cheerleaders…”
I’ve long thought that the networks and football orgs have been missing out by not having a separate channel that mostly shows the cheerleaders and only occasionally cuts away to a football play. As there are usually several games being played simultaneously, the Cheerleader Channel could jump around amongst the various scantily clad cheerleader groups.
"getting off on all the cheerleading bimbos."
He might be getting off on all the tight ends. 😉
Hey, if pastors can work on Sundays, then what's the laity's excuse?
That ain't workin'
That's the way you do it
Money for nothin', and your altar boys for free
This must have been the rough version that Dire Straits did. ;)
OT : grocery delivery, we were putting the food away and found an expensive bottle of Champagne. First time something we didn't order find it's way in one of our bags.
PROST!!!
Alain Prost ? 🤔
(I called the delivery man and gave it back, expensive cepage + magnum instead of standard bottle probably means special occasion).
"I called the delivery man and gave it back"
No, honest, it was empty when I got it!
*hic*
If I attempted to empty a bottle* by myself, I would need someone to call an undertaker 😁
* Too much binge drinking when I was younger. Now just the smell of any alcoholic drink give me nausea.
In my youth, we used to go to a vineyard run by a – I suspect alcoholic – Yugoslavian guy who would sell stuff to anyone. Sherry was incredibly sweet and incredibly cheap, so for approximately 25 cents you could get a half-gallon. I drank two thirds of it, had a glass of someone else's port, and spent a couple of hours walking round at 2 o'clock in the morning being sick over every lamppost I came across. Can't stand the smell of sherry to this day. Hardly drink these days anyway. When you get as old as I am a couple of drinks is often hangover territory.
You just made DM laugh.
I don't follow Formula 1 that close. Was just saying, "CHEERS!" 𝑎𝑢𝑓 𝑑𝑒𝑢𝑡𝑠𝑐ℎ.
No hablo alemàn 😝
Think sante (imagine accent mark).
A la tienne.
I've had that happen a couple of times with grocery deliveries. Never got anything I wanted or could use, though. It's been with rubbish like kale.
I've never had groceries delivered, but one day I found a large carton of half pound packs of butter on my front doorstep. Never found out who put it there or why. I rang the cops and their somewhat panicky reply was "We don't want it!". No help there. Eventually I just gave it away.
I've never been on the receiving end of an extra. I feel so left out.
I got a cookie with my noodles and co lunch the other day. I left it out at work so someone else could enjoy it, I already had a rice krispy treat.
We're a small office and people will regularly bring stuff in for everyone to share. We are trying to be a little healthier, so lately it's been more fruit and such. Someone recently brought in a big bowl of Chex Mix. WHO PUTS M&M'S IN CHEX MIX?!?
I do!!!!
Same here. I brought pie on pi day for everyone. We get cake for birthdays, I always ask for ice cream treats instead because A) they’re delicious, and B) they last for weeks.
I like sweet and salty, but to me chocolate just doesn't work with chex mix.
We usually do potluck for birthdays, I do different breads instead of cookies or cakes, although I am making playoff cookies for my hockey team.
And this is how the US turns into a theocracy, slowly and through the courts. Unless there is a serious backlash in the voting booths that's where we're going. FFS, we need to get rid of the electoral college.
I’m late to the party and haven’t read the 252 comments but….when someone takes a job that is specifically about covering holidays and weekends, should they be surprised when they are told to report on a weekend day?
The job started as a no-Sunday-delivery job. Then they got a new contract which included Sunday deliveries, but the PO used their other workforce to cover all those shifts (their attempt at reasonable accommodation). Then due to a combination of personnel issues - people leaving, one person broke their leg, etc - this reasonable accommodation became impossible, which is when they asked him to cover it.
Abuse always has consequences, always has blowback.
If this case opens the floodgates of religious privilege as described here, non-religious employees will suffer, employers will suffer, businesses will suffer and even fail, and people who depend on the goods and services of those failed businesses will suffer. Society in general will begin to resent religious people in general, because they're causing hardship for everyone else. They will enjoy their privileges for a while, but it will be less and less enjoyable to be religious because they will be more and more unpopular. Being religious will no longer be considered a virtue. It will be seen as a sign of selfishness. Young people won't want to be associated with anything resembling religion. Yet again, religion will be accelerating its ongoing extinction.
The irony here is that religious employees who demand generous accommodations such as being absent on Sundays depend on non-religious people to fill in for them. Meanwhile, they're also trying to convert non-religious people to their religion. If enough newly-converted employees make the same demands, the company will fail and everybody will be out of work.
The religious have proven that they care nothing for the suffering of others. It's part of their 2-millennia history.
May the blowback be Category 5 in strength.
"they care nothing for the suffering of others"
Yeah, but that's only because they're usually the cause of it.
Only too true. They have a habit and history of that dating back 1700 years.
That certainly is supported by the latest polls showing significant declines in religion, especially in the youngest folks, where many point to the hateful behavior of the religious and churches motivating the shift. I'll feel we've finally abandoned medieval thinking when believers are seen as little better than pariahs. The next few years are gonna be way too interesting with a lot more setbacks to come.
I've said in the past that religion will fight like a cornered, wounded animal as it slowly succumbs to its injuries.
Why are Christians like Groff such freaking crybabies?
When I was stationed in Bien Hoa AB in Vietnam (the biggest hot spot for Agent Orange. Not just in 'Nam but arguably the entire world), I worked 12-hour graveyard shifts with 9 days on and one day off. When I did a TDY to Tan Son Nhut AB in Saigon, I worked 12-hour day shifts with 12 days on and 1 day off. This where the daytime temps reached 120 degrees F (nighttime was less hot, but not a whole lot cooler)
Groff can just suck it up and stop whining.
How long till christian soldiers demand the right not to fight on Sundays?
Or at all.
But I thought they were always marching as to war with the cross of Jesus going on before? Not if anybody shoots back, I guess.
But you got cheap beer. 😇
There WAS that. :)
We really need to start discriminating against conservative Christians like they think we already do. Then maybe they'll actually be brought down to a level playing field.
To them, a level playing field IS discrimination/persecution.
Yeah, but maybe if they get a taste of ACTUAL persecution they'll shut up for a bit.
Christians with their mouths closed? Inconceivable!
Notice how Christians in America talk about persecution in this country yet avoid travelling to other countries to stand with their brethren who truly are being persecuted? They're way too comfortable and hate being even being mildly inconvenienced.
To be fair, that's a U.S. citizen thing. We get mighty upset at being mildly inconvenienced.
Christians, who have this allegedly awesome god in their corner, still seem to have no problem whining about absolutely everything not going their way....and even when it does.
The vanishingly rare places where they don't actually have hegemonic control.
OT - A slight miscommunication?
https://www.gocomics.com/cornered/2023/04/18
Sorry, no sympathy from this former Christian. I worked Sundays every week for 35 years. Ok, I was a parish preacher, but still...
You worked on the Sabbath yet weren't taken outside the city gates and stoned to death?
How times have changed. Religion really in decline. ;)
Send in the drones, they don't need a day off. : )
"Send in the drones"
♫Don't bother, they're here♫
And there's the added benefit that when drones come to the wrong door, moronic old white racists won't shoot them.
https://edition.cnn.com/2023/04/18/us/woman-shot-wrong-driveway-upstate-new-york/index.html
They don't even have to be racist. Though it probably helps. These things have completely cured my desire to be a door-to-door encyclopaedia salesman in the US.
Don't count on that.
Call me optimist. You wouldn't be the first to say I'm like Pollyanna. [Insert wisecrack here.]
Yes but, somebody has to fly them. 🕹
AI.
Not Alan, artificial intelligence. : )
Why not make it the "Alan Parsons Project"?
https://makeameme.org/meme/alan-parsons-project
That is a prescription for lawsuits.
I was going to make a Furturama reference about robot lawyers (even though the most famous one is a chicken), but it turns out that lawbots are a thing.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lawbot
Groff tried to make a claim under the Americans with Disabilities Act but couldn't meet the test because a Delusion, by its medical definition, excludes religious beliefs. Hence, Christianity cannot be claimed as a Disease.
That's what you think. 🤪
Two comments - As President Jackson said when the Supreme Court ruled removing the Cherokee Indians from Georgia was unconstitutional, "Let them enforce it." In the same vein, let SCOTUS enforce the new USPS rules. The other comment is that this whole Christian privilege argument will blow up when a business refuses to serve anyone wearing a Christian cross or an employee refuses to work with someone for the same reason.
Well, SCROTUS is really good at hypocrisy and making a ruling apply when they want it and not apply when they don’t. They will have no problem enforcing this case, punishing the employer for not accommodating his religious request but at the same time punishing a non-Christian employee who is perceived to be stepping on a Christian in the same way.
Well said. I once wrote a column exposing what the Good News Club really does. One person replied "Whats the problem? All the GNC is doing is bringing kids to jesus. I replied if he was OK with that he would be OK if another group wanted to bring kids to Allah. He said that was a different story. Why? Our task is to help Christian zelots think through their demands. Should another religion become dominate in America, they will want religious privelege too. I can hear the Christian zelots crying that the religious privlege laws they passed was only meant for Christians.
Some of them have already cried it. I've herd more than one christian apologist claim the Constitution only applies to christians, and even that only christians should be citizens.