225 Comments

Mixing religion and government is the same terrible idea it has always been. Ironically, the harder the evangelicals try to use the legislatures and courts to achieve what they failed to accomplish from their pulpits, the more people they alienate. A mind-set dominated by magical thinking just can't quite grasp the fact people do not want someone else's religion imposed on them, and they're not going to passively submit to it.

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"they're not going to passively submit to it."

No, they cannot understand why other people don't want someone else's religion crammed down their throats, but I do believe they are figuring on at least some resistance. That's what the new inquisition will be for, to ferret out those who will refuse to passively submit.

Man, that is a terrifying thought.

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That’s why 45% of the population, (many on the right wing) possess almost 500 million weapons. Supposedly christian beings will not only FORCE others to believe in their God at gunpoint, but as they already shown, they’ll commit any atrocity to spread their agenda.

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500 million...holy shit.

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Mixing church and state further corrupts both much further than either would on their own.

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Alienate away repukes. Keep on doing what you're doing repukes-it's working. You are SOOOOOO owning us libs-don't stop. You can wipe us out. FKNTURDS

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Someone doesn't have to go to church to necessarily think that they are "righteous" or in with god or whatever label they want to use to consider themselves ... while at the same time being bigoted, chauvinistic, white supremacist and/or anti-LGBTQ+. I think it needs to be remembered that a given individual THINKING they are religious or aligned with religion 𝗛𝗔𝗦 𝗡𝗢 𝗡𝗘𝗖𝗘𝗦𝗦𝗔𝗥𝗬 𝗥𝗘𝗟𝗔𝗧𝗜𝗢𝗡𝗦𝗛𝗜𝗣 𝗪𝗜𝗧𝗛 𝗔 𝗖𝗛𝗨𝗥𝗖𝗛.

And it wouldn't surprise me if a considerable count of such people constituted the "basket of deplorables" which Hillary Clinton so accurately described during the 2016 presidential campaign.

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Bingo. I know some people (relatives) and know of other people who don’t go to church anymore because they think their church isn’t “really Christian”.

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Which may well have cost her the election. A lot of independet-ish Obama voters flipped for Trump.

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The god is power. The religion is authoritarianism. That's all that is behind the Christian veneer they've put up.

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There's no other reasonable explanation for why they're so steadfast in their defense of pedophile clerics, clerics who force their girlfriends to have abortions, even clerics who steal from them, for christ's sake.

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Very true. Everything else is obfuscation and window dressing, at least to the fundagelicals.

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Morning, breakfast clubbers.

Let's face it: that Jesus fellow gets in the way of what the GQP want. Especially when he says things like this...

"Then he will say to those on his left, 'Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, I was a stranger to you and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me.' They will also answer 'Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?' He will reply, 'Truly I tell you, what you did not do for the least of one of these, you did not do for me.' Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life."

-- Matthew 25:41-46

I suspect they know Jesus is talking to the GQP. Feed, clothe, welcome and look after the poor, the homeless, the immigrant, the sick and imprisoned? That's just not in the GQPs wheelhouse. Little wonder they're skipping services.

(Even the Old Testament has YHVH telling his followers that they are not to mistreat immigrants...and why)

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Never know when the stranger you're threatening to rape might be an angel in disguise.

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Awkward, to say the least.

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When their wings shed feathers it's a dead giveaway.

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Dumb idiot Ham would use a fragmented version of Verse 41 of that passage to spew out fire and brimstone to anyone who rejects his creation fantasies. He plays "god" when he does crap like that.

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I took classes in seminary that taught how to cherry pick for intellectuals. They were called "Hermeneutics" named after the messenger of the gods, Hermes.

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I thought they were named after a guy named Herman Yutix.

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The same Ham who violates the 2nd Commandment by making a graven image and planning more (Tower of Babel is next).

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At least babble is something he really knows about.

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Hammy failed to understand that the Babel story was about his god being fearful of a united humanity accomplishing anything it set out to do without him. So he divided them by creating all these different languages.

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I expect so does our visiting apologist. Ze came for a No true Scotsman and I foolishly ended up engaging zir.

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Now, you know nothing good ever comes of that. :)

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Still wondering why Jesus spent so much of his omniscient, omnipotent time and energy creating "the poor, the homeless, the immigrant, the sick and imprisoned." They're the enemy of REAL Christians.

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Hence the overwhelmingly positive support by Republicans' for Trump's "big, beautiful health care system:" nothing.

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Evening, non sea dweller.

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Evening? It's 5 PM in France, as of this typing. :)

I know dinner won't be for a couple of hours yet, at the very least. What's on the menu for tonight?

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Fast*, I am too tired and sick to cook.

* I know it's not good, I will try to eat during the night.

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Sorry to hear this.

What are you doing posting? Get your rest. We'll still be here. Do what it takes to heal up.

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If I do that you won't see me before October at best.

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Yikes! Way too long.

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If we were actually made by a god, then we are exactly what he meant us to be.

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I'd like a refund.

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And damages claim.

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PUNITIVE damages ... and LOTS OF 'EM!

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I want the source code to the universe and a quick re-compile.

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42?

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The source code, not the answer.

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10 x = 6 * 7

20 PRINT X

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"E&OE"

JHWH

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This has made many people angry and is widely considered a bad move.

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Having never sinned, I really don't know what all the fuss is about.

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It seems to me like it's always been so with the religious Rightwing-nuts. Remember, back in 2015/16 they had a whole plethora of religious bigots and dingbat candidates to support in the GOP primaries... They briefly flirted with some of them, then dumped them all for the thrice-married, narcissistic, foul-mouthed pussy-grabber who hasn't cracked open a Bible in decades (or anything else that doesn't have his name on/in it.)

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“(or anything else that doesn't have his name on/in it.)“

Or has, but only if it wasn’t willing.

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Or reminds him of his eldest daughter.

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It's important to remember that many people who consider themselves Christian do not actually attend church at all. They don't even get the dubious moral guidance of a priest or pastor who has studied the Bible and Christian theology. Instead they're just picking and choosing the parts of the faith they or their family patriarch deems important. It can get even more twisted than what the church teaches. Especially when they believe that it doesn't really matter how they behave. So long as they accept Jesus, they're guaranteed a place in heaven. They have no pastor or priest to say, yes, but you haven't really accepted Jesus if you make no attempt at all to live as he instructed. Christianity is supposed to come with obligations to at least try to be somewhat Christlike. But these independent Christians... They're just... Christian because they said so.

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Then there are the Christians who follow their pastor. But their pastor is Greg Locke and his ilk.

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This is true also. Some pastors are charismatic showmen trying to get rich instead of serious students of theology trying to minister to their flock. (Both have their problems, but at least the second kind usually have decent motives.)

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I do believe there are misguided, but well-meaning, people in Christian ministry. They are called to help their fellow humans, but not by God. Unfortunately, they are greatly outnumbered by the ones in it for the money and the hate.

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I'm not sure that's true, about the hateful ones outnumbering the well-meaning ones. I've known kind, earnest Christians before. I think it's more that the hateful ones are loudest and richest, but I don't have any numbers to back it up.

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Any person who follows Greg Locke is following EVIL and Satan. They are the farthest thing from anything christian.

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But...are they really the farthest thing from anything christian? Who gets to define what makes a christian? Which of the 45,000 denominations of christianity is right?

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“This Republican Party would be less pious and polite. But it might be able to win more elections”

Less polite than “fuck your feelings”? Oh, they mean Bull Connor level of politeness. What the author is describing is a party openly white nationalist

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It doesn’t matter if they go to church or not, they’re fucking everything up for everyone and proud of it. They use god as this unquestionable authority in order to get away with it. The folks in charge of the GOP have always used Christianity to garner unearned respect and power. Trump isn’t special in his corruption and bad behavior, hell, he isn’t even special in his openness about his corruption and bad behavior. I don’t even understand how anyone could mention charisma in reference to him, his voice is grating, he has poor timing during speeches and jokes, he mumbles and stumbles over everything, he’s just good at doing the “say parts of sentences to allow the listener to insert their own thoughts into your speech” thing. But even that’s so obvious it’s irritating. I think a lot of why the GOP voters don’t go to church anymore is that society has begun to accept that weekly church going is not necessary, you can get your religion on the internet at your convenience and you get to shop around for the church thinking you like the most. It doesn’t count as going to church if you choose when to watch and maybe you watch six sermons in a day and none another day. You’re not tithing, you don’t have to bring in a hot dish, there’s no glad handing your pew mates, it’s a free for all.

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I think the potlucks are dying with the little old ladies who liked to cook for an army of teenagers.

Edit: At my mother's funeral a few years ago, they served a sandwich platter after the service. That's a far cry from the buffet served at my grandfather's funeral in the same church in the late 90s.

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I think the internet is ruining the potluck too. Have you watched some of the videos of folks making “the best potluck casserole” and it’s some idiot using their bare hands with the meat and not washing between steps, and then using their paper towel holder to hold up the chicken, mixing things in their sink and cooking with the hot water rather than the stove or substituting ingredients with processed foods like potato chips. I have yet to see a recipe video that isn’t an e-coli marketing ploy, or that is even remotely edible. I’m never eating at a potluck again.

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"People are so creative! ..."

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Covid has put me off of pot lucks and most buffets. Luckily I retired from ministry in time from a denomination ("United" Methodist) that sanctifies the covered dish over the Holy Grail.

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Well, my mother's funeral was before COVID.

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I avoid salad bars like the Plague.

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After my fathers funeral, the Catholic priest was immediately busted for cocaine use, possession and selling of As he was a “rent-a-priest” our family didn’t know this priest from Sam. The service was really OFF, bizarre and humorous. We just didn’t know WHY until the cops showed up & hauled the priest away. Christianity is a messed up farce.

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It's the "seldom or never" bit that I think is muddying the waters. There's a big, big difference between 𝘴𝘦𝘭𝘥𝘰𝘮 attending church- whatever that means; it's a fuzzy enough word on its own that it could mean anything from twice a month to once every ten years- and 𝘯𝘦𝘷𝘦𝘳 attending church. Why even include the "seldom" in "seldom or never" when you already have a "sometimes" option? This survey is just badly thought out.

For example, one might go to church for every religious holiday, for weddings, funerals, and whenever some more churchy family member invites them along, but because they don't go to weekly services, or on any particular schedule, answer "seldom." Still, they might be a complete zealot, and simply take issue with the pastor/priest/whatever, or find little value in the church community, or some other reason. All of those people are in the "seldom or never" category, even though they very much are practicing believers- and because of that, we have no way of knowing how big the "never" category really is.

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Setting any religious beliefs they may have aside, in favour of fascism. Christo-fascists. It's not the religion, it's the control over others. Christian belief is delusional, insane.

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To be fair, the differences between the two are quite minimal.

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The *overall* large drop in religiosity in the US over the past 5 years -> across the board drops in religiosity in Dems, GOPers, and Independents.

IMO big drops in church attendence may result in big social changes in the next generation or two, as "unchurched" children grow to adults having significantly different information sources and experiences. But for *this* generation of voting adults, it's as Hemant says. We should expect zero change in political views and voting patterns as they stop going to church. It's the same conservatives, they just decided to spend their Sunday mornings differently.

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It occurs to me that we need a survey / poll / whatever of the political leanings of the "nones" are. I think that would give a better understanding of those this article refers to, because I suspect that not all the nones are with US, necessarily.

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According to what I could find from PEW, about 2/3 of nones are on the left (vote for Dems, or identify as liberals, pro-choice, etc.). However *growth* of nones is occurring across pretty much all demographics...including politics. So for example, from 2008 to 2012 'unaffiliated' Dems went from 17% to 24% (of total Dems), while 'unaffiliated GOPers went from 9% to 11%.

So while it's fair to say that none-ism is mostly liberal, it would be innacurate to think that people are leaving religion and conservativisim all in one fell swoop. Rather, it seems to be the case that both liberals and conservatives are getting less religious. As to why the growth is faster on the left...well maybe more older liberals are leaving religion. But it's also probably in part due to the youth-none-liberal correlation. Every time someone ticks over 18 and starts answering surveys, they are very likely to be both none and liberal.

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The Church of Republicanism lets you customize your religion, so you only pray for what you need.

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What happened to my other comment? To whit: If christians believed in family values they wouldn't have voted for Trump ... or Boris, or Berlusconi, or Gingrich, or Rekers, or Hastert or.....................

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I see upvotes disappearing. They're in my posting history but not in the comment section of the article itself.

Also: I upvote people and those disappear, so I have to reaffix them.

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I think I may have mistakenly edited it out of existence. 😃

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"I upvote people and those disappear"

The people? Have you checked the corn field?

That's real good that you did that.

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That episode creeped me out as a kid.

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I have people I am forbidden to upvote.

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Most likely a Substack issue. Try the following:

https://support.substack.com/hc/en-us

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"Why go to church and sit through all the Jesus bullshit when right-wing media outlets serve up the same anti-LGBTQ, anti-abortion, anti-social justice, anti-sex, anti-public school, anti-science, anti-”woke” red meat without the boring parts?"

Nailed it...the Ron DeSantis platform!

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That is a great sentence.

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From DeSantis press conference at a church in Iowa filled with MAGAlites:

https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2023/06/06/politics/desantis-2024-republicans-fault-lines/index.html

"But then DeSantis spent nearly the next half hour detailing an ambitious, exhaustive and aggressively conservative agenda on social issues (such as a six-week abortion ban, and the removal of books from school classrooms and libraries)."

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Too bad for Republicans and DeSantis that 95% of their insane issues are LIES! As a 25 yr educator, I’ve yet to see discussion of gender changes, sex education and CRT in any public school curriculums for 1st, 3rd or even 5th graders. More right wing made up hysteria and religious lunatic nonsense. Keep the STUPID riled up. Yup let’s let the least educated people on the planet decide what all our kids can access and learn. They aren’t intelligent enough to think for themselves. Easy to manipulate all of them and have them believe ANYTHING that is suggested. Can ALWAYS tell who watches RW media. It’s hilarious watching some of them try to parrot what they they heard and mess it all up during one of their social media rages on Twitter, FB, and TikTok. They typically have NO idea what they are objecting to or why. Many of them are just barely literate. It’s beyond frightening that these people are taking over our schools. American society is dumbed down enough without these people influencing the youngest amongst us.

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