The good news seems to be that, despite the uptick that Pew Research found, starting around 2022, the overall trend in religiosity in the US is DOWN. The BAD news is that those who continue to be Christians and particularly evangelical Christians are becoming louder, more recalcitrant, far less likely to deconvert, and most importantly, MORE POLITICALLY ACTIVE. Personally, I think they see the trends Pew reports here, and They ... Are ... SCARED. It also doesn't help that we have Donald Trump in the White House, inciting them every chance he gets.
What this means, as though we didn't already know it, is that we have to get BUSY and push back like our country and its government depend on it. Because they do.
And why are they scared? They understand just enough of their history to know that when they are in control, the "others" are treated horribly. They are afraid that we will do to them what they have done to us for so many millenia. They don' understand that we are far more likely to put an arm around them and tell them not to be afraid -- that it's going to be ok.
Exactly, NOGODZ. People who mistreat others because they can always live in fear of losing power, because they're afraid they'll be treated the same way.
To be fair, some of them were, just not enough to make enough change. Sometimes that’s the only language certain people understand, violent uprisings to enact justice.
You know the Spartans were the most slave-holding city state in ancient Greece, right? One of the very few city-states to allow the enslavement of fellow Greeks and also practically the only city-state to enslave entire other towns to take their crops. Very much like the US south plantation model, vs. other city states where it was more the case that individual households might keep a slave or two
Heck the whole reason for the warrior ethos and why they had to train every male citizen to be a warrior was because - unlike the rest of Greece - the Spartans needed to constantly put down slave revolts.
Kinda pops the balloon on the whole hero image, doesn't it?
Thank you for elaborating on my point. I wasn't celebrating Sparta's hero image from that silly movie; I was using Gerard Butler's line to point out that the US has been just as stupid as Sparta by having slavery ourselves, using both people openly called slaves in the past and the undocumented immigrants and the incarcerated now.
My 75 year old Republican landlady is sure that something bad is about to come down. She has decided that she will have to move her Democratic cousin/BFF and me into her house.
She knows that neither of us knows how to load a gun, she will protect us! She can not grasp that it is her cohorts we are afraid of!
It’s how they think. They think everyone is JUST LIKE THEM, so they’re afraid when they’re not in power because of how they’d treat people like them.
It’s the exact same thinking they use on non-Christians: they “sincerely believe” that atheists KNOW the Christian God “exists”, and are just hating on it for giggles.
I think most of them are just plain evil sadistic bastards who revel in others being treated horribly, and are afraid all the dopamine hits they've become used to from watching that cruelty and suffering will be taken away from them. They're reacting like crack addicts who fear they're about to be forced into rehab.
They are fighting a desperate rear-guard action in the attempt to use the courts and government to accomplish what they have failed to achieve from their pulpits.
I, for one, would never trust any religious institution to safeguard my freedoms. Religion has a terrible track record on that score. I think there needs to be some distinctions drawn here. Christianity isn't a unitary thing, but is composed of thousands of competing factions. In my view they are all Christian in name only. There isn't even a unified Christian theology, but a morass of irreconcilable paradigms, not a one of which is supported by objective evidence.
I can't believe that ANY thinking person would trust their rights to religion. The religion that actually is founded on individual rights and personal integrity simply doesn't exist. Most if not all religions' focus is on bowing down to their deities, abjuring both their rights and their integrity TO SOMETHING THAT CANNOT BE DEMONSTRATED TO EXIST.
And you'll pardon me if I think that that's the height of insanity.
No, religion has NEVER been about freedom. It has always been about the rich controlling the masses.
Robert Green Ingersoll wrote:
"We have tried the government of priests and we know they are without mercy. In the administration of theocracy, all the instruments of torture have been invented...There has been in this country, a divorce between church and state.
This follows from the declaration that 'governments derive their just powers from the consent of the governed."
When has society at large ever benefitted under religious rule? The historical record has been painted in the blood of religion's victims. The words "God said..." have been followed by screams whenever religion was powerful.
Is anyone surprised by this? Even the conservative Christians who actually do care about others think that helping them means converting them to fit into Christianity's narrow boxes. As for the planet? They think God is in charge and will take care of the climate, so they don't have to. When it was said that it takes religion to get good people to do evil things, this is a concrete example.
I guess I'm kind of spoiled. I already live in the least-religious large metro area in the country. Not only that, we've been ranked the least religious city, period (Boston and San Francisco are close behind us).
Right now, almost two thirds of us here self-identify as non-religious. Maybe we can bump that percentage even higher. One can but hope. :)
I live in Berkeley (in the San Francisco Bay Area) and, yeah, feel kind of spoiled too. A few months ago, my nephew told me how shocked he was to actually see a car with a Trump bumpersticker on it--that's how rare these idiots are. Oh, and if they *do* show up? The last time that happened, they got egged: the grocery store they passed by sold out of egg flats, and the truckers whined non-stop about having to clean their trucks. It was mostly middle-aged and grey-haired folk who did that. So, even though this is a bubble, it's a pretty good one. The most active church in town is UU, which has a long history of progressive social action on a number of fronts.
Hadn't heard that one, but it's certainly true of Berkeley UU. What I've heard out of them is things like, "I believe in one god...at most." Good people who don't run cover for abusers in their religious group.
I'm a little surprised at the number of Cybertrucks I've seen on our streets (unless it's just one guy I keep seeing over and over). He hasn't had his monstrosity "decorated"...yet.
I think a lot of people who bought Teslas were liberal people who wanted to do their bit for the environment and so on. Cyber truck owners I'm not exactly sure about but I thought rednecks didn't buy electric cars?
Yeah, the truckers who did get egged here made some key mistakes: driving in a long convoy, along a narrow & busy street, turning onto another narrow & busy street, and disregarding locals (the real problem) including a grey-haired guy on a bike who slowed them waaaaaay down. Wouldn't have worked if there'd been only one, for instance. I wasn't there, but people took vids, and cheered each other on.
Well, not much snow here, unless you drive some hours, that's for sure. People always find something to bitch and moan about, no matter where they live. However, I'd rather be able trust my city & state to protect me and my rights, and those of others. So, no, even though it may be cheaper to live elsewhere than it is here, I find it a good trade-off. Besides, we in the Bay Area have a long progressive/radical history to live up to, and that's a good thing too.
At this point, their season is all but done. No playoffs for us.
Catch last night's game against the Blues? Awful. Normally stellar goalie Joey Daccord got yanked after letting in 5 and backup Niklas Kokko (making his NHL debut) let in 2 more. Neither got any goal support, especially Daccord. The Kraken finally potted a couple (both by ex-Blues players) but it was far too late.
Looking for kindness, compassion, protection of the vulnerable, fairness, and just basic decency? The only people who will look out for others are the secularists. The more religious they are, the less likely people are to give a damn about their fellow citizens. Turns out 'loving your neighbor as yourself' is too much trouble for most christians. What a shock. /s
Religious folks got the wrong message from the parable of the Good Samaritan. They think the story was telling them that the religious are supposed to be assholes ignoring the suffering good one of their own because someone else will come along to help.
I wouldn't pat ourselves on the secular back too much. A lot of that is entangled with politics. Just as evangelicalism can be a tribal marker for the "right wing first, theology is just what comes with it,' declaring onesself a secularist can be a tribal marker for "liberal first, and oh hey it seems like this secularism thing is just what my tribe does.'
Personally, I'd love to see secularism be popular on both right AND left and not be a tribal marker for anything. But I'll take the 46% that I can get. :)
I don't think anyone is taking an undeserved victory lap here. But, as the article points out, on all the markers of basic human decency and compassion, secularists come out far ahead of religionists. I wish that wasn't the case, and that religionists actually lived out the creed they supposedly believe in, but here we are.
I dropped my religion before I dropped my republican habits. Of course I was always concerned about others, I just thought certain policies would help more than others. That was before Obama was president and the response to him shone a light on the Republicans’ true character.
Maybe the loss of religion is a part of inherent liberalism (I am a progressive not liberal). Someone who has a so called bleeding heart might be more open to identifying the cruelty in religion, Christianity specifically, and then rejecting it for that reason. While atheism does not address morality, it is what folks who don’t believe are. As the atheist community is filled with folks who are liberals it attracts more of them. I know there are some very well known, loud and influential atheists that have proven to be less than liberal, or have become more cruel over time, but as these numbers show, overall they’re kinder and more tolerant. (Unless you piss me off. ;-))
I don’t think you are wrong, I just think it may be more of a chicken and egg thing. They influence each other simultaneously. IMHO
I'm not trying to start a 'which came first' debate, because I think some things are just inherent. In my experience, the religion I grew up in [catholic] worked hard to suppress the good instincts I had naturally, e.g., understanding implicitly that banning women from the priesthood was inequitable, knowing the disparate treatment of priests versus nuns was unfair, being horrified at being told my best friend [a methodist] couldn't go to heaven was evil.
There's a reason religions try to 'get 'em while they're young.' Children are more malleable and open to suggestion and suppression. But eventually, at least in my case, my earliest character traits, impulses, whatever you want to call them, would no longer remain suppressed. That's when I started down the road of deconversion. Does that make me inherently liberal or progressive? I don't know. But it does seem that liberal views on the world and its issues more closely align with where I've always been. That's the best I can do with that question.
Here’s my other thought for today, the only one I really have time for. Hemant wrote:
“ You get the idea here. No matter the topic, atheists (and Secular Americans in general) tend to take the positions that protect the vulnerable, minimize suffering, and consider long-term ramifications. Religious Americans are more likely to screw over the vulnerable, people who don’t look like them, and even our planet itself.”
Here comes the sociologist:
TRIBALISM!!!!!!!!!
Whatever functions or purposes religion may have served in previous times, religion has always been about tribalism— my tribe is good, your tribe is bad, and whatever my tribe does to your tribe is justified by the fact that my tribe is good, and your tribe is bad. And in the last 45 years, as religion has become politicized in this country, it has also become more tribalized. As I have written more times than I can count: the goals of modern religion in the United States are power, money, religious dominion (another aspect of power) and in the age of Trump, REVENGE on all of those people who dared to challenge the Dominion of the Tribe.
1. I grew up in a non religious household, which begat raising my kids in a non religious household, which will beget raising their kids in a non religious household, which will beget…..
2. I’m not surprised that even people who were raised with religion are backing off. What critical thinking people want to be members of a club who harbor pedophiles and grifters?
More and more, people can see the disconnect between religion and morality, which the religious mistakenly believe are inherently interconnected. In the words of Christopher Hitchens from "God is Not Great":
"Human decency is not derived from religion, It precedes it."
Animals display empathy and compassion. None of them have ever read a religious text.
Thanks Hemant. Your article underscores that the biggest predictor of Trump support is religiosity and that the rural/suburban/urban and working class/college-educated divides are just reflections of religiosity in the final analysis. The January 6th insurrection was essentially a religious pageant of apostolic and evangelical cosplay. And the same holds true for his more ardent supporters and enablers in the government whether strange goth catholic (JD with hid black eyeliner) or the more conventional dominionists and faith-based crypto grifters. One needs to enter their worldview to make sense of their motivation (unfortunately). Those of us who come from an ex-evangelical childhood understand this.
EX kkkatlik here. I undertood this years ago. I got my first inkling in 4th or 5th grade when the damned nun said all the people in the church across the street were going to hell. I realized that a lot of my friends went to that church. THAT began my escpe from religion. I realized then that god was all about hatred.
IMHO, Christianity already shook out the ones most likely to leave. Remember the Instapot? Everyone who really wanted one got one and there weren't enough new customers to keep the company going. Same idea. Most of those remaining will stay regardless of what the Church does.
One can only hope. The attitudes of many of the younger generations doesn't encourage me. Plus, you have states like OK trying to force Christianity into schools. It's like the religion can't grow without the backing of the State.
If Trump can convince Bondi to use the resources of the DOJ to imprison everyone still alive who was involved in that show, I will happily become a MAGA person./s
Not sure what you're talking about here. The show with Linda Evans and Joan Collins involved ONE dynasty, and it took place in (then) contemporary America, not "Ancient Egypt."/s
Package deals that were probably cheaper than individual licenses for the exact number of users, which also leaves new employees without the licenses they need to do their jobs.
They haven't had time or personnel to do a thoughtful audit of these departments. The way they're hacking and slashing they'll likely end up spending *more* money.
Yep. It will cost money to fix all the damage they've caused.
I can't believe there's no legal way to stop this shit. I know a couple of judges have tried, but my impression is, these assholes are just thumbing their noses at the legal system.
But then, this seems to be a pattern. Repugs do whatever the hell they want, stuff that would get ordinary people thrown in jail until the Second Coming, and they run roughshod over people and protocols, with absolutely zero security clearances and no fucking goddamn clue what they are doing.
Yet there is actually nothing anybody can do. (?) All we can do is watch from the sidelines while they take a wrecking ball to everything we need to be a functioning society. (?)
Learning and studying takes time and costs money. They are in a huge hurry to abolish taxes on billionaires. Even though Pro Publica says mot pay taxes asa low a a fraction of 1%. You and I have every penny reported to the IRS and taxes taken out every payday. Billionaires face no such hurdles.
Musk doesn’t care about anyone who he thinks is his inferior. To Musk, the inferior people are expendable, cannon fodder/ workforce that he can use, abuse, and kill without any thought or consequence.
Chris Hayes of MSNBC now reports the FDA has canceled a conclave to discuss next year's flu vaccine. YOU hAVE MY DEEPEST SYMPATHY, FOLKS!!! You will need far more than sympathy.
The good news seems to be that, despite the uptick that Pew Research found, starting around 2022, the overall trend in religiosity in the US is DOWN. The BAD news is that those who continue to be Christians and particularly evangelical Christians are becoming louder, more recalcitrant, far less likely to deconvert, and most importantly, MORE POLITICALLY ACTIVE. Personally, I think they see the trends Pew reports here, and They ... Are ... SCARED. It also doesn't help that we have Donald Trump in the White House, inciting them every chance he gets.
What this means, as though we didn't already know it, is that we have to get BUSY and push back like our country and its government depend on it. Because they do.
And why are they scared? They understand just enough of their history to know that when they are in control, the "others" are treated horribly. They are afraid that we will do to them what they have done to us for so many millenia. They don' understand that we are far more likely to put an arm around them and tell them not to be afraid -- that it's going to be ok.
Not surprisingly, that was the same fear white South Africans had about dismantling apartheid.
The white plantation owners of the antebellum south lived in constant fear of their slaves rising up and murdering them in their beds.
They might have slept easier if they hadn't owned human beings like cattle.
Exactly, NOGODZ. People who mistreat others because they can always live in fear of losing power, because they're afraid they'll be treated the same way.
To be fair, some of them were, just not enough to make enough change. Sometimes that’s the only language certain people understand, violent uprisings to enact justice.
It’s starting to look like it might be the only way.
This...is...SPARTA!!!
You know the Spartans were the most slave-holding city state in ancient Greece, right? One of the very few city-states to allow the enslavement of fellow Greeks and also practically the only city-state to enslave entire other towns to take their crops. Very much like the US south plantation model, vs. other city states where it was more the case that individual households might keep a slave or two
Heck the whole reason for the warrior ethos and why they had to train every male citizen to be a warrior was because - unlike the rest of Greece - the Spartans needed to constantly put down slave revolts.
Kinda pops the balloon on the whole hero image, doesn't it?
Thank you for elaborating on my point. I wasn't celebrating Sparta's hero image from that silly movie; I was using Gerard Butler's line to point out that the US has been just as stupid as Sparta by having slavery ourselves, using both people openly called slaves in the past and the undocumented immigrants and the incarcerated now.
That's exactly why Handmaid's Tale Christianity is going to be imposed on us, despite what the Pew Research people say.
My 75 year old Republican landlady is sure that something bad is about to come down. She has decided that she will have to move her Democratic cousin/BFF and me into her house.
She knows that neither of us knows how to load a gun, she will protect us! She can not grasp that it is her cohorts we are afraid of!
You should be so happy. Republicans are such good people!
"Only the best people."
BINGO!!!
It’s how they think. They think everyone is JUST LIKE THEM, so they’re afraid when they’re not in power because of how they’d treat people like them.
It’s the exact same thinking they use on non-Christians: they “sincerely believe” that atheists KNOW the Christian God “exists”, and are just hating on it for giggles.
I think most of them are just plain evil sadistic bastards who revel in others being treated horribly, and are afraid all the dopamine hits they've become used to from watching that cruelty and suffering will be taken away from them. They're reacting like crack addicts who fear they're about to be forced into rehab.
They are fighting a desperate rear-guard action in the attempt to use the courts and government to accomplish what they have failed to achieve from their pulpits.
And unfortunately, the Trumpian Government and courts have been more than accommodating.
I, for one, would never trust any religious institution to safeguard my freedoms. Religion has a terrible track record on that score. I think there needs to be some distinctions drawn here. Christianity isn't a unitary thing, but is composed of thousands of competing factions. In my view they are all Christian in name only. There isn't even a unified Christian theology, but a morass of irreconcilable paradigms, not a one of which is supported by objective evidence.
I can't believe that ANY thinking person would trust their rights to religion. The religion that actually is founded on individual rights and personal integrity simply doesn't exist. Most if not all religions' focus is on bowing down to their deities, abjuring both their rights and their integrity TO SOMETHING THAT CANNOT BE DEMONSTRATED TO EXIST.
And you'll pardon me if I think that that's the height of insanity.
I agree.
No, religion has NEVER been about freedom. It has always been about the rich controlling the masses.
Robert Green Ingersoll wrote:
"We have tried the government of priests and we know they are without mercy. In the administration of theocracy, all the instruments of torture have been invented...There has been in this country, a divorce between church and state.
This follows from the declaration that 'governments derive their just powers from the consent of the governed."
Exactly! I mean, the Vatican literally has “treasure rooms” filled with billions of dollars worth of art and materials!
The pope sits on a LITERAL throne made of gold! And encrusted with gems!!
While families in poor parishes struggle and are told 'god works in mysterious ways' or some such drivel.
When has society at large ever benefitted under religious rule? The historical record has been painted in the blood of religion's victims. The words "God said..." have been followed by screams whenever religion was powerful.
Religion is a blight on humanity.
Religion is the festering, oozing pus filled sore on the ass of humanity. Until people stop believing in imaginary friends, humanity won’t progress.
It has the potential to become a powerful force for equality, justice and equal opportunities for everyone.
I have been saying literally for at least 45 years; religion is not what ennobles mankind, it is what prevents us from advancing as a species.
But never will thanks to being run by grifters.
There was that one time. For five minutes. It was a Tuesday. But it was long ago.
Citation. ; )
𝑅𝑒𝑙𝑔𝑖𝑜𝑢𝑠 𝐴𝑚𝑒𝑟𝑖𝑐𝑎𝑛𝑠 𝑎𝑟𝑒 𝑚𝑜𝑟𝑒 𝑙𝑖𝑘𝑒𝑙𝑦 𝑡𝑜 𝑠𝑐𝑟𝑒𝑤 𝑜𝑣𝑒𝑟 𝑡ℎ𝑒 𝑣𝑢𝑙𝑛𝑒𝑟𝑎𝑏𝑙𝑒, 𝑝𝑒𝑜𝑝𝑙𝑒 𝑤ℎ𝑜 𝑑𝑜𝑛’𝑡 𝑙𝑜𝑜𝑘 𝑙𝑖𝑘𝑒 𝑡ℎ𝑒𝑚, 𝑎𝑛𝑑 𝑒𝑣𝑒𝑛 𝑜𝑢𝑟 𝑝𝑙𝑎𝑛𝑒𝑡 𝑖𝑡𝑠𝑒𝑙𝑓.
Is anyone surprised by this? Even the conservative Christians who actually do care about others think that helping them means converting them to fit into Christianity's narrow boxes. As for the planet? They think God is in charge and will take care of the climate, so they don't have to. When it was said that it takes religion to get good people to do evil things, this is a concrete example.
I guess I'm kind of spoiled. I already live in the least-religious large metro area in the country. Not only that, we've been ranked the least religious city, period (Boston and San Francisco are close behind us).
Right now, almost two thirds of us here self-identify as non-religious. Maybe we can bump that percentage even higher. One can but hope. :)
I live in Berkeley (in the San Francisco Bay Area) and, yeah, feel kind of spoiled too. A few months ago, my nephew told me how shocked he was to actually see a car with a Trump bumpersticker on it--that's how rare these idiots are. Oh, and if they *do* show up? The last time that happened, they got egged: the grocery store they passed by sold out of egg flats, and the truckers whined non-stop about having to clean their trucks. It was mostly middle-aged and grey-haired folk who did that. So, even though this is a bubble, it's a pretty good one. The most active church in town is UU, which has a long history of progressive social action on a number of fronts.
I have always liked Unitarians. As Tom Robbins said, they will embrace any heresy.
Hadn't heard that one, but it's certainly true of Berkeley UU. What I've heard out of them is things like, "I believe in one god...at most." Good people who don't run cover for abusers in their religious group.
I’ve never had any bad thoughts about Unitarian at all. Baptists? Well, you know…
And don't get me started on the catholic church...
I'm a little surprised at the number of Cybertrucks I've seen on our streets (unless it's just one guy I keep seeing over and over). He hasn't had his monstrosity "decorated"...yet.
I think a lot of people who bought Teslas were liberal people who wanted to do their bit for the environment and so on. Cyber truck owners I'm not exactly sure about but I thought rednecks didn't buy electric cars?
The Cybertruck has become a totem of the Rogan Bro-verse here in South Florida.
Stink…I mean Musk didn’t invent the Tesla autos. He just bought the company.
The Cybertrucks? Those are his. And he handled the task about as well as could be expected of a moron.
They appeal to fans of dystopian sci-fi that identified with the fascists. (Whose vehicles bore a striking resemblance to CTs)
Yeah, the truckers who did get egged here made some key mistakes: driving in a long convoy, along a narrow & busy street, turning onto another narrow & busy street, and disregarding locals (the real problem) including a grey-haired guy on a bike who slowed them waaaaaay down. Wouldn't have worked if there'd been only one, for instance. I wasn't there, but people took vids, and cheered each other on.
You're making me want to move there. Although Minnesota isn't too bad...compared to Florida.
Well, not much snow here, unless you drive some hours, that's for sure. People always find something to bitch and moan about, no matter where they live. However, I'd rather be able trust my city & state to protect me and my rights, and those of others. So, no, even though it may be cheaper to live elsewhere than it is here, I find it a good trade-off. Besides, we in the Bay Area have a long progressive/radical history to live up to, and that's a good thing too.
Go Bears!
Da Bears!
(Oops. Wrong Bears)
I keep hoping that the Kraken will turn things around.
At this point, their season is all but done. No playoffs for us.
Catch last night's game against the Blues? Awful. Normally stellar goalie Joey Daccord got yanked after letting in 5 and backup Niklas Kokko (making his NHL debut) let in 2 more. Neither got any goal support, especially Daccord. The Kraken finally potted a couple (both by ex-Blues players) but it was far too late.
At least you didn't give your goalie a big contract only to have his play suck afterwards like the NY Rangers.
Looking for kindness, compassion, protection of the vulnerable, fairness, and just basic decency? The only people who will look out for others are the secularists. The more religious they are, the less likely people are to give a damn about their fellow citizens. Turns out 'loving your neighbor as yourself' is too much trouble for most christians. What a shock. /s
Religious folks got the wrong message from the parable of the Good Samaritan. They think the story was telling them that the religious are supposed to be assholes ignoring the suffering good one of their own because someone else will come along to help.
And they still don't like that other person coming along to help, because THEY have already deemed the sufferer Unworthy.
I wouldn't pat ourselves on the secular back too much. A lot of that is entangled with politics. Just as evangelicalism can be a tribal marker for the "right wing first, theology is just what comes with it,' declaring onesself a secularist can be a tribal marker for "liberal first, and oh hey it seems like this secularism thing is just what my tribe does.'
Personally, I'd love to see secularism be popular on both right AND left and not be a tribal marker for anything. But I'll take the 46% that I can get. :)
I don't think anyone is taking an undeserved victory lap here. But, as the article points out, on all the markers of basic human decency and compassion, secularists come out far ahead of religionists. I wish that wasn't the case, and that religionists actually lived out the creed they supposedly believe in, but here we are.
I dropped my religion before I dropped my republican habits. Of course I was always concerned about others, I just thought certain policies would help more than others. That was before Obama was president and the response to him shone a light on the Republicans’ true character.
Maybe the loss of religion is a part of inherent liberalism (I am a progressive not liberal). Someone who has a so called bleeding heart might be more open to identifying the cruelty in religion, Christianity specifically, and then rejecting it for that reason. While atheism does not address morality, it is what folks who don’t believe are. As the atheist community is filled with folks who are liberals it attracts more of them. I know there are some very well known, loud and influential atheists that have proven to be less than liberal, or have become more cruel over time, but as these numbers show, overall they’re kinder and more tolerant. (Unless you piss me off. ;-))
I don’t think you are wrong, I just think it may be more of a chicken and egg thing. They influence each other simultaneously. IMHO
I'm not trying to start a 'which came first' debate, because I think some things are just inherent. In my experience, the religion I grew up in [catholic] worked hard to suppress the good instincts I had naturally, e.g., understanding implicitly that banning women from the priesthood was inequitable, knowing the disparate treatment of priests versus nuns was unfair, being horrified at being told my best friend [a methodist] couldn't go to heaven was evil.
There's a reason religions try to 'get 'em while they're young.' Children are more malleable and open to suggestion and suppression. But eventually, at least in my case, my earliest character traits, impulses, whatever you want to call them, would no longer remain suppressed. That's when I started down the road of deconversion. Does that make me inherently liberal or progressive? I don't know. But it does seem that liberal views on the world and its issues more closely align with where I've always been. That's the best I can do with that question.
Also, hard agree on pissing me off. 😉
𝔜𝔢 𝔬𝔩𝔡𝔢 4 𝔱𝔬 14 𝔴𝔦𝔫𝔡𝔬𝔴.
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/e09066e28b286dd3402779bf31fdd9d0774672faadd4d6a090ff44850a652173.jpg
Here’s my other thought for today, the only one I really have time for. Hemant wrote:
“ You get the idea here. No matter the topic, atheists (and Secular Americans in general) tend to take the positions that protect the vulnerable, minimize suffering, and consider long-term ramifications. Religious Americans are more likely to screw over the vulnerable, people who don’t look like them, and even our planet itself.”
Here comes the sociologist:
TRIBALISM!!!!!!!!!
Whatever functions or purposes religion may have served in previous times, religion has always been about tribalism— my tribe is good, your tribe is bad, and whatever my tribe does to your tribe is justified by the fact that my tribe is good, and your tribe is bad. And in the last 45 years, as religion has become politicized in this country, it has also become more tribalized. As I have written more times than I can count: the goals of modern religion in the United States are power, money, religious dominion (another aspect of power) and in the age of Trump, REVENGE on all of those people who dared to challenge the Dominion of the Tribe.
1. I grew up in a non religious household, which begat raising my kids in a non religious household, which will beget raising their kids in a non religious household, which will beget…..
2. I’m not surprised that even people who were raised with religion are backing off. What critical thinking people want to be members of a club who harbor pedophiles and grifters?
Sadly there aren't many critical thinkers in the world.
More and more, people can see the disconnect between religion and morality, which the religious mistakenly believe are inherently interconnected. In the words of Christopher Hitchens from "God is Not Great":
"Human decency is not derived from religion, It precedes it."
Animals display empathy and compassion. None of them have ever read a religious text.
Well....
https://media1.giphy.com/media/v1.Y2lkPTc5MGI3NjExMWg1Y2d2eXNjOWRraTJidWFxa282aXdtOHQ0bG15ZXVoM2U3bGw5aiZlcD12MV9pbnRlcm5hbF9naWZfYnlfaWQmY3Q9Zw/l2Sq9mbCZwBb33jQA/giphy.gif
It's all those cookies Santa eats.
Now I'm reminded of this
youtu.be/HTGlUMvbhSw
Animals are smarter than humans in a lot of ways.
is this true ladies??? 😱
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/e4b475776fb9461f82db0d2b95cf69ec16153b6bb19d870357fe1281a1674f7d.jpg
Bathroomphomet.
you really are the dark prince of puns
*Takes a bow* :)
Devilishly clever.
All that dancing. Do they have a 666 pack?
I once had a cell phone number with a 666 exchange (yes, seriously!). 😈 Does that count?
Only when the Moon is full.
I must have gone to the wrong bathrooms.
Always wanted to be a girl so I could join in. Well, other reasons, too.
I'll never tell. 😈
sounds like you need to take mourner to your favorite ladies restroom hang out. 😈 I am giving this thread former senator Larry Craig vibes.
Thanks Hemant. Your article underscores that the biggest predictor of Trump support is religiosity and that the rural/suburban/urban and working class/college-educated divides are just reflections of religiosity in the final analysis. The January 6th insurrection was essentially a religious pageant of apostolic and evangelical cosplay. And the same holds true for his more ardent supporters and enablers in the government whether strange goth catholic (JD with hid black eyeliner) or the more conventional dominionists and faith-based crypto grifters. One needs to enter their worldview to make sense of their motivation (unfortunately). Those of us who come from an ex-evangelical childhood understand this.
EX kkkatlik here. I undertood this years ago. I got my first inkling in 4th or 5th grade when the damned nun said all the people in the church across the street were going to hell. I realized that a lot of my friends went to that church. THAT began my escpe from religion. I realized then that god was all about hatred.
Ex-evangelical here. Spot-on, everything you said.
IMHO, Christianity already shook out the ones most likely to leave. Remember the Instapot? Everyone who really wanted one got one and there weren't enough new customers to keep the company going. Same idea. Most of those remaining will stay regardless of what the Church does.
But the silver lining to that, dear Alverant, those who are staying are also dying off. These people will be replaced by more secular generations.
One can only hope. The attitudes of many of the younger generations doesn't encourage me. Plus, you have states like OK trying to force Christianity into schools. It's like the religion can't grow without the backing of the State.
Need more Muppet remakes instead of live-action remakes.
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/79194a3b3caea64c2d38c2202b3646dd7af2e4a558ec401fc6463644a5a042bf.png
WTF?
Muppets are live-action (discounting "Muppet Babies") :)
NSFW
https://r34i.paheal-cdn.net/f1/08/f1082db6d1ba0465e511c3da59500375
Makin’ bacon?
I remember watching "Muppet Babies" as a kid. Definitely something you can discount.
My grown brother liked it for some odd reason. What little I saw of it I despised.
If Trump can convince Bondi to use the resources of the DOJ to imprison everyone still alive who was involved in that show, I will happily become a MAGA person./s
Mr. D'arcy?
https://th.bing.com/th/id/OIP.9xIuz6YwxCZNfOplCm36aQHaEn?w=309&h=193&c=7&r=0&o=5&dpr=1.4&pid=1.7
OT : https://youtu.be/OF41GIVBP8k?si=7YFz8aIveDaVyqId
For those not familiar with Ancient Egypt dynasties, he is none other than Hatshepsut half-brother and husband.
When I was young my Mummy taught me about Ancient Egypt.
That's a wrap.
Bet it was all a pyramid scheme.
You are in de Nile.
🤬
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meretseger_(queen)
Canope you stop already ?
How often were Bud and Lou around?
For a hour or two every Saturday.
In 1939 Moe, Larry and Curly said "We want out mummy."
"...Ancient Egypt dynasties..."
Not sure what you're talking about here. The show with Linda Evans and Joan Collins involved ONE dynasty, and it took place in (then) contemporary America, not "Ancient Egypt."/s
*Trying to make sense of this bunch of random words*
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dynasty_(1981_TV_series)
Pre 1993, when I was in my "no TV" era.
I never watched a single episode, but you couldn't escape the promo commercials over here.
Well this is hilarious.
Elmo has escalated his feud with Bill Gates and has publicly called for a boycott and audit of Microsoft.
Mac users and Microsoft haters have pledged support for Microsoft.
Clash of the Titans, the reboot.
Who will be the last billionaire standing?
Link, please.
https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/technology/tech-news/elon-musks-doge-finds-excess-software-licenses-in-agencies-more-of-your-tax-dollars-/articleshow/118571126.cms I have not read this yet. about to fix myself some dinner.
Package deals that were probably cheaper than individual licenses for the exact number of users, which also leaves new employees without the licenses they need to do their jobs.
They haven't had time or personnel to do a thoughtful audit of these departments. The way they're hacking and slashing they'll likely end up spending *more* money.
Yep. It will cost money to fix all the damage they've caused.
I can't believe there's no legal way to stop this shit. I know a couple of judges have tried, but my impression is, these assholes are just thumbing their noses at the legal system.
But then, this seems to be a pattern. Repugs do whatever the hell they want, stuff that would get ordinary people thrown in jail until the Second Coming, and they run roughshod over people and protocols, with absolutely zero security clearances and no fucking goddamn clue what they are doing.
Yet there is actually nothing anybody can do. (?) All we can do is watch from the sidelines while they take a wrecking ball to everything we need to be a functioning society. (?)
Hope the GQP is thinking of retiring that claim of being the Party of Law and Order. They have more than shown that they are the polar opposite.
Learning and studying takes time and costs money. They are in a huge hurry to abolish taxes on billionaires. Even though Pro Publica says mot pay taxes asa low a a fraction of 1%. You and I have every penny reported to the IRS and taxes taken out every payday. Billionaires face no such hurdles.
What's on the menu ?
pork fried rice and few frozen egg rolls.
Funny, I had yuxian eggplants with rice.
that sounds delicious
Found on FB. Stupid me closed it and can’t find it again.
A google search found similar, but none of the pledges.
Interesting considering Gates doesn't own MS anymore.
Leon cares nothing for facts.
Musk doesn’t care about anyone who he thinks is his inferior. To Musk, the inferior people are expendable, cannon fodder/ workforce that he can use, abuse, and kill without any thought or consequence.
Chris Hayes of MSNBC now reports the FDA has canceled a conclave to discuss next year's flu vaccine. YOU hAVE MY DEEPEST SYMPATHY, FOLKS!!! You will need far more than sympathy.
At least they seem to have backed down on the veterans' medical care.