The only people with valid opinions on the legitimacy of slavery, are slaves. This idiot preacher clearly identifies as a slave owner, and probably can't imagine himself being held in bondage.
There was a difference between being an indentured servant in America and chattel slavery. My first ancestor to what became the USA did so as an indentured servant. He signed up for it in Germany where he was to receive passage for him and his family and land after a term of 7 years labor. THere was an end date to indentured servitude, and the labor was either for significant economic reward (Passage, land, relief of debt) or prison sentence. Chattal slavery was perpetual and generational with no reasonable hope of relief for the slave or their descendents.
Slavery with an expiration date is still slavery. Under the Roman republic slaves had a legal right to buy their freedom (as difficult as that was for the majority of them). That doesn't change the fact that they were still slaves. And just because indentured servitude came with a "use by" date doesn't make it significantly different from slavery in any other way.
You clearly don't understand the difference between indentured servitude and chattel. The former is VOLUNTARY, and established by contract beforehand. Even ancient Rome where some slaves could buy their freedom, they were forced into slavery. by conquest or birth. American indentured servitude, was an employment contract. And it was totally different because the holder of the contract could not harm or kill the worker without legal punishment. The offspring were not chattel either. By confusing the two conditions or equating them diminishes the generational suffering of the true saves. Much like the claim "Irish were treated as bad as slaves" does and is as false.
If a person wanted to come to the US and didn't have the means to do it, i.e. if the only way they could come here was by "voluntarily" signing them selves into servitude, how free and voluntary was it, really? Strictly speaking, yes it was, but as a practical reality...? Strictly speaking, healthcare is voluntary in the US, but realistically, what other option is there? Buying food is voluntary, too, but realistically...? Yes, being an indentured servant wasn't quite as bad a being a slave, but blithely dismissing it as voluntary ignores the awful economic realities people had to live under. Why do you think indentured servitude was abolished?
FYI, it was the $20 she was being considered for. To replace Andrew Jackson. I know him to be a rabid anti-indigenous racist, I'm not sure on the ferocity of his anti-African racism. (in comparison to the general attitude of his day) But in any case not a good President. AIUI up until about 7 years ago, many considered him the worst we'd ever had.
There are seven different denominations of euro banknotes: €5, €10, €20, €50, €100, €200, and €500. Each has a distinctive colour and size,[17] and displays examples of a historical European architectural style:[17][18] windows or gateways on the obverse, and bridges on the reverse.[17][18] The architectural examples featured are stylised illustrations of the corresponding style, rather than representations of existing structures.[17][18
What wicked ways? Well if they weren’t wicked they wouldn’t have been enslaved. See he’s good because he’s free and rich and a preacher and white, so automatically in god’s favor. Even his abuse and probable SA is not wicked because it’s for Jesus. They’re all bad because they’re all slaves and penniless and suffering and black.
Do you hear it? Is it just my imagination? Whenever I hear somebody saying something to the effect that slavery was "not so bad," or "beneficial for the slaves," or even "the slaves liked it," I hear murmuring deep in the speaker's throat the next statement wanting desperately to explode out, "SO LET'S BRING SLAVERY BACK!"
Plus jamais. Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it. Those who deny history WANT to repeat it.
Some of them think that "no establishment" just means no official Church of the United States. They think they can mandate Christianity as long as they don't mandate which denomination.
We don't need more "Jesus" a fabrication of what someone deems as their own person private interpretation. We need sanity, reason, empathy, love, compassion, science and critical thinking. That's what we need. Religion, especially of this sort only produces bigots and anti-intellectuals, anti-science, anti-reason, illogical meanderings of people who have this cultist mindset to evangelize and foist to the world by hook or by crook this insane uneducated and childish hateful mindset like a parasite to a host. Hopefully there will always be pushback, a reasoned response that will always fight against this kind of religious bedlam.
"...sanity, reason, empathy, love, compassion, science and critical thinking." These are qualities I would have expected from General Flynn - a three-star general.
"That was a wise pastor that warned his flock [that January 6 was a trap"].
It certainly netted a fair number of Christians engaging in open insurrection against the government of the United States. One might even refer to them as religious terrorists.
It certainly netted a fair number of Christians engaging in open insurrection against the government of the United States. One should refer to them as religious terrorists. FIFY
People like Keller have been doing that a lot lately. What they've failed to notice is that there are those outside of their bubble who hear it ... and don't like it very much.
This fool clearly expects his putrid religiosity to be deferred to at all times and never challenged. Thus, he can make up a history that serves to confirm his biases, and largely gets away with it. There is no horror that cannot be justified in the name of religion, and this is a great example of it.
And yet ANOTHER day that ends in "Y." It's become eminently clear that people like Keller will say ANYTHING to try to justify their positions, and if their statements don't align with fact or history, that's just a trivial inconvenience. Then, too, the people he's preaching to would treat history as a succession of inconvenient facts, up to and possibly including the shibboleth about the South rising again.
These are people who insist on living in what appears to be a very well reinforced bubble ... which makes me wonder and worry about what happens when said bubble inevitably BREAKS.
He knows his history, he just wants to repeat it so he makes sure that congregation doesn’t know the history. Many people, Daughters of the Confederacy, intentionally rewrite history to try to go back to enslaving others. With the SCOTUS stacked as it is, without ethics standards or oversight, they are coming close to achieving their goal.
You’ve read The Handmaid’s Tale, yes? That’s one thing that could happen when the bubble bursts. Maybe not exactly like that, but I’d rather not find out what they have in mind.
This was pretty much my history courses at Baptist elementary in the 80's.
Black people, for the most part, didn't exist at all in the history books. But slavery was seen as mostly benevolent and something Black people should be grateful for since it brought them to America and introduced them to Jesus.
And the same motherfuckers are trying to push the same lies again so racism and white supremacy will endure for another generation.
Let's never forget that after slavery, it was "good" Christians like the preacher here who would gather into mobs and lynch and dismember innocent Black people, take body parts as souvenirs, then go home, change into their Sunday best, and show up to sing praises to the Lord the following morning.
It was "good" Christian people who stood outside of schools and screamed hate and profanity at a little girl trying to get an education.
It was "good" Christian people who stood with assault rifles opposing BLM protests.
"You are the sons of those who murdered the prophets... yet you say, If we had lived in our father's days we would not have acted like them. Yet you testify against yourselves that you are the sons of murderers. Fill up then the measure of your guilt that the blood of every prophet from Abel to Zachariah might be accounted to you..."
The title makes the point about the racist asshole being Josh Duggar's FIL. Would we have even heard of this if he wasn't? How many times is this said that we don't hear about.
It's safe to assume this is the standard in any white church you stumble across. The only difference between one and another is how open and honest about it they are.
200+ years ago some folks living in a colony, under a King, decided to protest…
Folks who benefit from the status quo always preach against protest. Which really means the protests are making a difference. Not that I support the Jan. 6th riots, they were insurrection and really a giant temper tantrum (seriously, flinging poo is not a protest) that was intended to be violent and bloody. However, protests are as American as apple pie and baseball. More so.
CHRISTIANS: "Why do people hate us so?"
This is one reason right here, cristers.
Suuure, Frederick Douglass and Harriet Tubman loved being slaves. Actually they even helped recruiting more slaves for the pro slavery states 🙄
"what “wicked ways” were the enslaved people turning from"
Believing they were humans and had rights ?
The only people with valid opinions on the legitimacy of slavery, are slaves. This idiot preacher clearly identifies as a slave owner, and probably can't imagine himself being held in bondage.
I am all for him knowing the "joy" of being an indentured servant.
There was a difference between being an indentured servant in America and chattel slavery. My first ancestor to what became the USA did so as an indentured servant. He signed up for it in Germany where he was to receive passage for him and his family and land after a term of 7 years labor. THere was an end date to indentured servitude, and the labor was either for significant economic reward (Passage, land, relief of debt) or prison sentence. Chattal slavery was perpetual and generational with no reasonable hope of relief for the slave or their descendents.
Slavery with an expiration date is still slavery. Under the Roman republic slaves had a legal right to buy their freedom (as difficult as that was for the majority of them). That doesn't change the fact that they were still slaves. And just because indentured servitude came with a "use by" date doesn't make it significantly different from slavery in any other way.
You clearly don't understand the difference between indentured servitude and chattel. The former is VOLUNTARY, and established by contract beforehand. Even ancient Rome where some slaves could buy their freedom, they were forced into slavery. by conquest or birth. American indentured servitude, was an employment contract. And it was totally different because the holder of the contract could not harm or kill the worker without legal punishment. The offspring were not chattel either. By confusing the two conditions or equating them diminishes the generational suffering of the true saves. Much like the claim "Irish were treated as bad as slaves" does and is as false.
If a person wanted to come to the US and didn't have the means to do it, i.e. if the only way they could come here was by "voluntarily" signing them selves into servitude, how free and voluntary was it, really? Strictly speaking, yes it was, but as a practical reality...? Strictly speaking, healthcare is voluntary in the US, but realistically, what other option is there? Buying food is voluntary, too, but realistically...? Yes, being an indentured servant wasn't quite as bad a being a slave, but blithely dismissing it as voluntary ignores the awful economic realities people had to live under. Why do you think indentured servitude was abolished?
He already is.
?
The wicked ways of not being right wing Christian as well.
I hope I will see Mrs Tubman face on the 5 $ dollar bill before my death.
$20 bill - it has the added benefit of removing Andrew Jackson from the currency.
My bad. I should have checked before posting.
And I should have finished reading the thread. :)
FYI, it was the $20 she was being considered for. To replace Andrew Jackson. I know him to be a rabid anti-indigenous racist, I'm not sure on the ferocity of his anti-African racism. (in comparison to the general attitude of his day) But in any case not a good President. AIUI up until about 7 years ago, many considered him the worst we'd ever had.
Jackson was a slave owner. https://www.whitehousehistory.org/slavery-in-the-andrew-jackson-white-house
TBF, so were several other Presidents.
BTW, Hope it's a good Birthday.
Thanks. I've never been able to convince myself getting older is anything to celebrate, though. 😩
The $5 bill has Mr. Lincoln on it. :)
I don't even know who or what is on Euros bills, I identify them by their color 😅
There are seven different denominations of euro banknotes: €5, €10, €20, €50, €100, €200, and €500. Each has a distinctive colour and size,[17] and displays examples of a historical European architectural style:[17][18] windows or gateways on the obverse, and bridges on the reverse.[17][18] The architectural examples featured are stylised illustrations of the corresponding style, rather than representations of existing structures.[17][18
I thought France uses the euro.
We do. I just don't pay attention. I use my card most of the time.
What wicked ways? Well if they weren’t wicked they wouldn’t have been enslaved. See he’s good because he’s free and rich and a preacher and white, so automatically in god’s favor. Even his abuse and probable SA is not wicked because it’s for Jesus. They’re all bad because they’re all slaves and penniless and suffering and black.
According to the Book of Mormon if they repented they would become “white and delightsome” so clearly they haven’t repented yet. /s
Do you hear it? Is it just my imagination? Whenever I hear somebody saying something to the effect that slavery was "not so bad," or "beneficial for the slaves," or even "the slaves liked it," I hear murmuring deep in the speaker's throat the next statement wanting desperately to explode out, "SO LET'S BRING SLAVERY BACK!"
Plus jamais. Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it. Those who deny history WANT to repeat it.
"Whenever I hear anyone arguing for slavery, I feel a strong impulse see it tried on him personally."
-- Abraham Lincoln, in a speech to the 140th Indiana Regiment, March 17th, 1865
Abe would have been a great internet commenter.
Or had his own blog.
Lincoln's Logs.
ISWYDT :)
As Nogodz implies, anyone saying slavery wasn't so bad always assumes they wouldn't have been the slave.
"Maybe there's a place for protests. I don't know."
It's in the Constitution, so there's that.
Christians HATE the Constitution. Especially that "no establishment of religion" part.
Some of them think that "no establishment" just means no official Church of the United States. They think they can mandate Christianity as long as they don't mandate which denomination.
Wonder how they get around Article 6, Clause 3?
The same way ammosexuals go around the second part of the 2nd Amendment.
My grandson's other grandpa is a member of a well regulated militia. It's called the Arkansas National Guard.
Deep state then, right? 😁
They don't know it's there. Or "we aren't testing which denomination, so it's ok".
It's the first one.
Reading is for little people.
Aaaah, some odd phrase about "redress of grievances" ... but who pays any attention to that? 🤦♂️
That and freedom of assembly.
We don't need more "Jesus" a fabrication of what someone deems as their own person private interpretation. We need sanity, reason, empathy, love, compassion, science and critical thinking. That's what we need. Religion, especially of this sort only produces bigots and anti-intellectuals, anti-science, anti-reason, illogical meanderings of people who have this cultist mindset to evangelize and foist to the world by hook or by crook this insane uneducated and childish hateful mindset like a parasite to a host. Hopefully there will always be pushback, a reasoned response that will always fight against this kind of religious bedlam.
But...but...if religion gives people comfort, what's wrong with that? (TM)
*coughcough*INQUISITIONS!
Not much comfort given to nonbelievers.
What people didn't like being pressed with stones or hanged or burned at the stake? (Remember where the term faggot comes from)
Christians seemed to delight in inventing perverted ways to cause unimaginable suffering to their victims.
As the Ghoul of Kolkatta (FB) so aptly demonstrated (on others) they believe suffering brings you closer to God.
I may believe pain is an inevitable part of maturing, but suffering benefits no one.
I'm sure drugs give comfort to addicts too.
Drugs are illegal, and bad. Christianity is tantamount to the law, and good.
Christian Logic 101.
Not all drugs are illegal. Many drug addicts are done legally.
What's a west coaster doing up this early?
Say the one often liking my comments at 4 or 5 am Florida time 😁
I wake up at 3:30am every morning and hit the gym. After that, get ready for work.
Windows Key + period, then click Ω, the last column on the right third row down.
"...sanity, reason, empathy, love, compassion, science and critical thinking." These are qualities I would have expected from General Flynn - a three-star general.
"That was a wise pastor that warned his flock [that January 6 was a trap"].
It certainly netted a fair number of Christians engaging in open insurrection against the government of the United States. One might even refer to them as religious terrorists.
It certainly netted a fair number of Christians engaging in open insurrection against the government of the United States. One should refer to them as religious terrorists. FIFY
The "might" was a bit of tongue-in-cheek. :)
Was the "wise pastor" also an Admiral?
He said the "white" part of White Christian Nationalism out loud.
People like Keller have been doing that a lot lately. What they've failed to notice is that there are those outside of their bubble who hear it ... and don't like it very much.
This fool clearly expects his putrid religiosity to be deferred to at all times and never challenged. Thus, he can make up a history that serves to confirm his biases, and largely gets away with it. There is no horror that cannot be justified in the name of religion, and this is a great example of it.
𝑀𝑖𝑘𝑒 𝐾𝑒𝑙𝑙𝑒𝑟 𝑑𝑜𝑒𝑠𝑛’𝑡 𝑘𝑛𝑜𝑤 ℎ𝑖𝑠 ℎ𝑖𝑠𝑡𝑜𝑟𝑦.
And yet ANOTHER day that ends in "Y." It's become eminently clear that people like Keller will say ANYTHING to try to justify their positions, and if their statements don't align with fact or history, that's just a trivial inconvenience. Then, too, the people he's preaching to would treat history as a succession of inconvenient facts, up to and possibly including the shibboleth about the South rising again.
These are people who insist on living in what appears to be a very well reinforced bubble ... which makes me wonder and worry about what happens when said bubble inevitably BREAKS.
He knows his history, he just wants to repeat it so he makes sure that congregation doesn’t know the history. Many people, Daughters of the Confederacy, intentionally rewrite history to try to go back to enslaving others. With the SCOTUS stacked as it is, without ethics standards or oversight, they are coming close to achieving their goal.
You’ve read The Handmaid’s Tale, yes? That’s one thing that could happen when the bubble bursts. Maybe not exactly like that, but I’d rather not find out what they have in mind.
"𝘞𝘦𝘳𝘦 𝘐 𝘵𝘰 𝘣𝘦 𝘢𝘨𝘢𝘪𝘯 𝘳𝘦𝘥𝘶𝘤𝘦𝘥 𝘵𝘰 𝘵𝘩𝘦 𝘤𝘩𝘢𝘪𝘯𝘴 𝘰𝘧 𝘴𝘭𝘢𝘷𝘦𝘳𝘺, 𝘯𝘦𝘹𝘵 𝘵𝘰 𝘵𝘩𝘢𝘵 𝘦𝘯𝘴𝘭𝘢𝘷𝘦𝘮𝘦𝘯𝘵, 𝘐 𝘴𝘩𝘰𝘶𝘭𝘥 𝘳𝘦𝘨𝘢𝘳𝘥 𝘣𝘦𝘪𝘯𝘨 𝘵𝘩𝘦 𝘴𝘭𝘢𝘷𝘦 𝘰𝘧 𝘢 𝘳𝘦𝘭𝘪𝘨𝘪𝘰𝘶𝘴 𝘮𝘢𝘴𝘵𝘦𝘳 𝘵𝘩𝘦 𝘨𝘳𝘦𝘢𝘵𝘦𝘴𝘵 𝘤𝘢𝘭𝘢𝘮𝘪𝘵𝘺 𝘵𝘩𝘢𝘵 𝘤𝘰𝘶𝘭𝘥 𝘣𝘦𝘧𝘢𝘭𝘭 𝘮𝘦. 𝘍𝘰𝘳 𝘰𝘧 𝘢𝘭𝘭 𝘴𝘭𝘢𝘷𝘦𝘩𝘰𝘭𝘥𝘦𝘳𝘴 𝘸𝘪𝘵𝘩 𝘸𝘩𝘰𝘮 𝘐 𝘩𝘢𝘷𝘦 𝘦𝘷𝘦𝘳 𝘮𝘦𝘵, 𝘳𝘦𝘭𝘪𝘨𝘪𝘰𝘶𝘴 𝘴𝘭𝘢𝘷𝘦𝘩𝘰𝘭𝘥𝘦𝘳𝘴 𝘢𝘳𝘦 𝘵𝘩𝘦 𝘸𝘰𝘳𝘴𝘵. 𝘐 𝘩𝘢𝘷𝘦 𝘦𝘷𝘦𝘳 𝘧𝘰𝘶𝘯𝘥 𝘵𝘩𝘦𝘮 𝘵𝘩𝘦 𝘮𝘦𝘢𝘯𝘦𝘴𝘵 𝘢𝘯𝘥 𝘣𝘢𝘴𝘦𝘴𝘵, 𝘵𝘩𝘦 𝘮𝘰𝘴𝘵 𝘤𝘳𝘶𝘦𝘭 𝘢𝘯𝘥 𝘤𝘰𝘸𝘢𝘳𝘥𝘭𝘺, 𝘰𝘧 𝘢𝘭𝘭 𝘰𝘵𝘩𝘦𝘳𝘴." - 𝑭𝒓𝒆𝒅𝒆𝒓𝒊𝒄𝒌 𝑫𝒐𝒖𝒈𝒍𝒂𝒔𝒔
No additional comment required.
Fantastic quote. Thanks!
Really [cut-paste!]
He rejected god belief. Can't imagine why...
This was pretty much my history courses at Baptist elementary in the 80's.
Black people, for the most part, didn't exist at all in the history books. But slavery was seen as mostly benevolent and something Black people should be grateful for since it brought them to America and introduced them to Jesus.
And the same motherfuckers are trying to push the same lies again so racism and white supremacy will endure for another generation.
Let's never forget that after slavery, it was "good" Christians like the preacher here who would gather into mobs and lynch and dismember innocent Black people, take body parts as souvenirs, then go home, change into their Sunday best, and show up to sing praises to the Lord the following morning.
It was "good" Christian people who stood outside of schools and screamed hate and profanity at a little girl trying to get an education.
It was "good" Christian people who stood with assault rifles opposing BLM protests.
"You are the sons of those who murdered the prophets... yet you say, If we had lived in our father's days we would not have acted like them. Yet you testify against yourselves that you are the sons of murderers. Fill up then the measure of your guilt that the blood of every prophet from Abel to Zachariah might be accounted to you..."
There's no difference between willful ignorance and malice, and there's no one more willfully ignorant than christians.
And hateful. https://scontent-ord5-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/356615474_6753980661303164_4845193662721854768_n.jpg?stp=dst-jpg_p843x403&_nc_cat=108&cb=99be929b-59f725be&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=5cd70e&_nc_ohc=AQ2rKkiqtiUAX-dLcpw&_nc_ht=scontent-ord5-1.xx&oh=00_AfAbfsqbp_evAkYOPP-VwGM0SM0CAdJannLGkkry8iITdg&oe=64A19F5B
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cc1anrSbdjM
obligatory.
“ Also, who says “the Blacks”?!”
That would be the Racists.
The Klan. The Nazis. The rest of the asshats.
The title makes the point about the racist asshole being Josh Duggar's FIL. Would we have even heard of this if he wasn't? How many times is this said that we don't hear about.
Gothard's legacy strikes again.
It's safe to assume this is the standard in any white church you stumble across. The only difference between one and another is how open and honest about it they are.
Not by any of mine USAian inlaws.
You’re being kind when you say this is Christian ignorance.
More like bullish religious tenacity and bollocking.
Friendly even.
200+ years ago some folks living in a colony, under a King, decided to protest…
Folks who benefit from the status quo always preach against protest. Which really means the protests are making a difference. Not that I support the Jan. 6th riots, they were insurrection and really a giant temper tantrum (seriously, flinging poo is not a protest) that was intended to be violent and bloody. However, protests are as American as apple pie and baseball. More so.