An old H. L. Mencken quote comes to mind - "Puritanism is the haunting fear that someone, somewhere is happy." I grew up in the South and I am pretty sure that cross-dressing is frowned upon by the SBC. I do not know what the Baptists call excommunication or disfellowshipping, but I think that is what awaits him - unless he gets down on his knees and tearfully begs Jeebus to forgive him.
Once again, we've got Baptists of one stripe or another getting bent out of shape on a sexual issue. This issue HARMS NO ONE and has no particular impact (at least none that I can see) on his functions as mayor or pastor. Yet the powers-that-be want to create an enormous foofaraw around it, because bible-morality-SOMETHING.
Apparently, those who would judge Bubba can't take him at his word when he says that it's just something that he does to relieve stress. Then, too, there's that strain of Baptists that take EVERYTHING SERIOUSLY, and nothing can be beneath their notice. It makes me wonder how they live their lives and if there's any joy at all in them.
Hate to say it, but I don't see this turning out well for Copeland, and that's a shame ... but then, shame is what those who are harassing him are all about.
Copeland says "There's no instruction manual for this job. However, I do have my own personal manual and that is my Bible. God will sustain you through anything as long as you commit your life to Him."
He might want to consult his manual, as it condemns men and women who wear each others clothing.
He also said (after his alternate life was aired) "It's a hobby I do to relieve stress. I have a lot of stress..."
It seems his god and manual aren't all they're cracked up to be.
Bravo, Hamant -- your well-reasoned, sensible reaction distills the extreme irresponsibility of Craig Monger and 1819 News, which posted a "story" in search of a purpose.
In his LinkedIn bio blurb, the so-called reporter says he's a former theology student who's "humbly joining my Alabama brethren in the pursuit of truth." But as you accurately note, not all truths deserve to be made public. "There ought to be a damn good reason," indeed.
OT : just saw one of the doctors. I will have to come back, date unknown for now, to stay several days in diabetology. I was, of course, overjoyed at the prospect of DM alone at home and told such to the doctor.
Doctor : "We can arrange for a stay in the same ward for your mother".
I seriously consider it. DM alone at home is a big NO !
PS : Since diabetes is considered a pandemic here, my hopital bills should amount to 0. Sorry cdbunch.
"As far as I can tell, there’s no evidence that Copeland himself has ever participated in those right-wing attacks. I have yet to see a sermon clip where he rails against drag queens or trans people. I can’t find a single policy he’s promoted as mayor that would make life worse for the LGBTQ community."
Then he does not deserve to be outed. Only those who try to oppress the LGBT community and are hypocrites deserve to be outed.
The Church has no business in our bedrooms. The State has no business in our bedrooms. Period. As an atheist, I may not agree with his religious beliefs, but what the Mayor/Pastor does with his wife behind closed doors, consensually, is no one else's business. End of story. The mistake this man made was placing his private pictures on line. Rather than condemning the Pastor, he, and his church should allow this to be a teaching moment and he should sit down with folks from the LGBTQ community, especially transgender folks and talk about issues of concern. These people are human beings first and foremost, something that I am sure the man you worship and follow would like to remind you of. After all, Jesus did hang out with 'Tax collectors and sinners.' He also spent a lot, and I mean A LOT of time with twelve other dudes.
You also bring up a great point. When we hear the word 'Baptist' we jump tp the conclusion that they are the foaming at the mouth type Baptists that are ready to call for the deaths of LGBTQ folks. (IFB Pastors). Or Southern Baptists who may not be that extreme as the IFB, but would love to see Gay rights abolished. However not all Baptist churches believe this. There are many that are affirming churches and openly welcome LGBTQ+ folks into their membership.
I'm always bemused when I run across any sort of story about "cross-dressing", because it's yet another reminder of the modern USA's obsession with sex-role stereotyping. How much attention do you suppose ever gets paid to this "issue" in rural China, where everybody dresses in shapeless shirts and baggy pants and works in the fields. How would you even EXPRESS the idea that you wanted to be the “other” sex if nobody could readily tell the difference?
But the USA is so hyper-sexually aware that we have different sports leagues, different bathrooms, different baby clothes, different acceptances of assertiveness, different hairstyles, even different awards for acting and singing, all dependent on the very, Very, VERY, VVEERRYY important distinction of what your reproductive plumbing is.
I woke up way too early to untangle this- there is just 𝘴𝘰 𝘮𝘶𝘤𝘩 to unpack here. Here's a few undeveloped thoughts:
- The fact that it was a right-wing outlet which broke the story, and that there is of yet no evidence of hypocrisy here, leads me to be more critical of the 𝘰𝘶𝘵𝘪𝘯𝘨 than the 𝘰𝘶𝘵-𝘦𝘦 for now. If we were talking about someone from the left yanking the curtain on a known hate-preacher, that'd be a different thing entirely.
- At first blush, it kinda looks like this pastor would like to be more outwardly progressive than the rest of the sect, but has to dogwhistle about it instead of saying it outright, like some sort of odd inversion of the way bigots do when they think the space they're in wouldn't be accepting of their bigotry.
- I hope you checked your pockets after meeting Chump.
*𝘦𝘥𝘪𝘵- More data, indeed. Whether Pastor Copeland was a drag queen or a trans woman doesn't really matter, now, does it? I don't think it really even matters what his sermons were about, at this point. All 1819 News cared about is that a person dared to wear the wrong article of clothing with the wrong naughtybits, and that to their minds was sufficient cause to destroy a life. He's just another victim of the Nat-C culture war, now- and proof of their true intentions. This is the outcome they 𝘸𝘢𝘯𝘵𝘦𝘥, when they ran that story. Full stop.
I am assuming that the conservative staff member of 1819 who accidentally stumbled upon the racy Instagram account of “Transitioning Transgender Curvy Girl” only did it because he was thoroughly investigating how woke culture was destroying the traditional family unit, and for no other reason. He had absolutely no other reason to be cruising transgender Instagram accounts other that to research how evil they were. And he didn't want to corrupt the other staffers, and that's why he did it late at night, and why the door to his office was lock. He also had a cold, which would explain the amount of tissues. And he had dry skin, which explains the hand cream.
Once again, I must thank Hemant for a balanced account of the situation.
The general evidence is that neither the Pastor nor his church has taken anti-LGBT positions. That's unique, considering where his parish is located.
So, while I can be one of the harshest judges of church follies and foibles, give Bubba a pass. He could help with change more than the joy of punishment.
If he’s not damning LGBT people, it’s fine. But I’m not sure that cosplaying a transitioning transgender person is really all that great. Be a cross dresser, that has a long and distinguished history. There’s just something about pretending to be transgender that puts me off, they’ve been demonized so much, and even murdered for being transgender that it gives me the ick. I’m not condemning him, or trying to shame him or anything, but maybe he should think twice about that aspect of what he’s doing if he’s not really transgender. And I’m willing to hear an argument from transgender folks who don’t agree with my take. I’m open to being wrong about it.
The rest of it, he doesn’t deserve to be scrutinized negatively just for dressing as a woman. I dressed up as Ursula for Halloween, it’s just fun to step outside our selves for a while. I’ve dressed as a man on occasion.
One of the problems with managing a large group of people using fear is that you have to keep that fear going. It needs new targets regularly or it starts to fizzle; living your life afraid all the time takes a lot of energy, and if people have time to stop and think they might start wondering what they were afraid of. Can't have that!
I may well be wrong, but looking at this, what I see is an attempt to keep that fear going. Sure, it's reprehensible and a cheap shot, but that's not the sort of thing that stops some people. What I see is a desperate attempt at "Look! Look! It's even in CHURCHES now!" to try and keep the sheeple in line, because for me, the news over the last month or so has been pretty close to the "All Israel, all the time" channel. (Yes, the war in Israel/Gaza is important, and yes, I want updates. But some of the news has been more than a shade lackluster, and for a while it was all the news talked about for the whole program.) This pastor probably doesn't deserve it, from what I've seen, but he'll wind up suffering for it anyway; if he gets lucky he'll land on his feet so to speak.
So long as the person isn't hurting LGBTQ people, I don't particularly care what he does in his spare time and neither should anyone else.
I suppose the folks in his church might want to talk about whatever erotica he wrote and if it violated their church's teachings, but that's for them to decide.
An old H. L. Mencken quote comes to mind - "Puritanism is the haunting fear that someone, somewhere is happy." I grew up in the South and I am pretty sure that cross-dressing is frowned upon by the SBC. I do not know what the Baptists call excommunication or disfellowshipping, but I think that is what awaits him - unless he gets down on his knees and tearfully begs Jeebus to forgive him.
Once again, we've got Baptists of one stripe or another getting bent out of shape on a sexual issue. This issue HARMS NO ONE and has no particular impact (at least none that I can see) on his functions as mayor or pastor. Yet the powers-that-be want to create an enormous foofaraw around it, because bible-morality-SOMETHING.
Apparently, those who would judge Bubba can't take him at his word when he says that it's just something that he does to relieve stress. Then, too, there's that strain of Baptists that take EVERYTHING SERIOUSLY, and nothing can be beneath their notice. It makes me wonder how they live their lives and if there's any joy at all in them.
Hate to say it, but I don't see this turning out well for Copeland, and that's a shame ... but then, shame is what those who are harassing him are all about.
Copeland says "There's no instruction manual for this job. However, I do have my own personal manual and that is my Bible. God will sustain you through anything as long as you commit your life to Him."
He might want to consult his manual, as it condemns men and women who wear each others clothing.
He also said (after his alternate life was aired) "It's a hobby I do to relieve stress. I have a lot of stress..."
It seems his god and manual aren't all they're cracked up to be.
Bravo, Hamant -- your well-reasoned, sensible reaction distills the extreme irresponsibility of Craig Monger and 1819 News, which posted a "story" in search of a purpose.
In his LinkedIn bio blurb, the so-called reporter says he's a former theology student who's "humbly joining my Alabama brethren in the pursuit of truth." But as you accurately note, not all truths deserve to be made public. "There ought to be a damn good reason," indeed.
OT : just saw one of the doctors. I will have to come back, date unknown for now, to stay several days in diabetology. I was, of course, overjoyed at the prospect of DM alone at home and told such to the doctor.
Doctor : "We can arrange for a stay in the same ward for your mother".
I seriously consider it. DM alone at home is a big NO !
PS : Since diabetes is considered a pandemic here, my hopital bills should amount to 0. Sorry cdbunch.
"As far as I can tell, there’s no evidence that Copeland himself has ever participated in those right-wing attacks. I have yet to see a sermon clip where he rails against drag queens or trans people. I can’t find a single policy he’s promoted as mayor that would make life worse for the LGBTQ community."
Then he does not deserve to be outed. Only those who try to oppress the LGBT community and are hypocrites deserve to be outed.
The Church has no business in our bedrooms. The State has no business in our bedrooms. Period. As an atheist, I may not agree with his religious beliefs, but what the Mayor/Pastor does with his wife behind closed doors, consensually, is no one else's business. End of story. The mistake this man made was placing his private pictures on line. Rather than condemning the Pastor, he, and his church should allow this to be a teaching moment and he should sit down with folks from the LGBTQ community, especially transgender folks and talk about issues of concern. These people are human beings first and foremost, something that I am sure the man you worship and follow would like to remind you of. After all, Jesus did hang out with 'Tax collectors and sinners.' He also spent a lot, and I mean A LOT of time with twelve other dudes.
You also bring up a great point. When we hear the word 'Baptist' we jump tp the conclusion that they are the foaming at the mouth type Baptists that are ready to call for the deaths of LGBTQ folks. (IFB Pastors). Or Southern Baptists who may not be that extreme as the IFB, but would love to see Gay rights abolished. However not all Baptist churches believe this. There are many that are affirming churches and openly welcome LGBTQ+ folks into their membership.
Well... congratulations, you wingnut ghouls- I'd say "I hope you're proud of yourselves," but you probably fucking are.
I'm not even gonna call it a suicide. This was a murder.
I'm always bemused when I run across any sort of story about "cross-dressing", because it's yet another reminder of the modern USA's obsession with sex-role stereotyping. How much attention do you suppose ever gets paid to this "issue" in rural China, where everybody dresses in shapeless shirts and baggy pants and works in the fields. How would you even EXPRESS the idea that you wanted to be the “other” sex if nobody could readily tell the difference?
But the USA is so hyper-sexually aware that we have different sports leagues, different bathrooms, different baby clothes, different acceptances of assertiveness, different hairstyles, even different awards for acting and singing, all dependent on the very, Very, VERY, VVEERRYY important distinction of what your reproductive plumbing is.
I woke up way too early to untangle this- there is just 𝘴𝘰 𝘮𝘶𝘤𝘩 to unpack here. Here's a few undeveloped thoughts:
- The fact that it was a right-wing outlet which broke the story, and that there is of yet no evidence of hypocrisy here, leads me to be more critical of the 𝘰𝘶𝘵𝘪𝘯𝘨 than the 𝘰𝘶𝘵-𝘦𝘦 for now. If we were talking about someone from the left yanking the curtain on a known hate-preacher, that'd be a different thing entirely.
- At first blush, it kinda looks like this pastor would like to be more outwardly progressive than the rest of the sect, but has to dogwhistle about it instead of saying it outright, like some sort of odd inversion of the way bigots do when they think the space they're in wouldn't be accepting of their bigotry.
*𝘦𝘥𝘪𝘵- D̷i̷d̷ ̷n̷o̷b̷o̷d̷y̷ ̷t̷e̷l̷l̷ ̷y̷o̷u̷ ̷t̷h̷a̷t̷ ̷"̷d̷r̷a̷g̷ ̷q̷u̷e̷e̷n̷"̷ ̷w̷a̷s̷ ̷a̷n̷ ̷o̷p̷t̷i̷o̷n̷,̷ ̷h̷o̷n̷e̷y̷?̷ ̷B̷e̷c̷a̷u̷s̷e̷ ̷i̷f̷ ̷y̷o̷u̷'̷r̷e̷ ̷n̷o̷t̷ ̷a̷c̷t̷u̷a̷l̷l̷y̷ ̷a̷ ̷w̷o̷m̷a̷n̷,̷ ̷t̷h̷a̷t̷'̷s̷ ̷t̷h̷e̷ ̷t̷e̷r̷m̷ ̷y̷o̷u̷ ̷s̷h̷o̷u̷l̷d̷'̷v̷e̷ ̷b̷e̷e̷n̷ ̷u̷s̷i̷n̷g̷ ̷t̷o̷ ̷d̷e̷s̷c̷r̷i̷b̷e̷ ̷y̷o̷u̷r̷ ̷a̷l̷t̷e̷r̷ ̷e̷g̷o̷.̷.̷.̷ ̷b̷u̷t̷ ̷i̷f̷ ̷y̷o̷u̷'̷v̷e̷ ̷l̷i̷v̷e̷d̷ ̷y̷o̷u̷r̷ ̷w̷h̷o̷l̷e̷ ̷l̷i̷f̷e̷ ̷i̷n̷ ̷a̷ ̷r̷i̷g̷h̷t̷-̷l̷e̷a̷n̷i̷n̷g̷ ̷c̷h̷u̷r̷c̷h̷y̷ ̷b̷u̷b̷b̷l̷e̷,̷ ̷m̷a̷y̷b̷e̷ ̷y̷o̷u̷ ̷d̷i̷d̷n̷'̷t̷ ̷r̷e̷a̷l̷i̷z̷e̷ ̷t̷h̷e̷r̷e̷ ̷w̷a̷s̷ ̷a̷ ̷d̷i̷f̷f̷e̷r̷e̷n̷c̷e̷?̷ ̷O̷r̷ ̷m̷a̷y̷b̷e̷ ̷t̷h̷e̷r̷e̷'̷s̷ ̷s̷o̷m̷e̷t̷h̷i̷n̷g̷ ̷e̷l̷s̷e̷ ̷g̷o̷i̷n̷g̷ ̷o̷n̷?̷
- I hope you checked your pockets after meeting Chump.
*𝘦𝘥𝘪𝘵- More data, indeed. Whether Pastor Copeland was a drag queen or a trans woman doesn't really matter, now, does it? I don't think it really even matters what his sermons were about, at this point. All 1819 News cared about is that a person dared to wear the wrong article of clothing with the wrong naughtybits, and that to their minds was sufficient cause to destroy a life. He's just another victim of the Nat-C culture war, now- and proof of their true intentions. This is the outcome they 𝘸𝘢𝘯𝘵𝘦𝘥, when they ran that story. Full stop.
I am assuming that the conservative staff member of 1819 who accidentally stumbled upon the racy Instagram account of “Transitioning Transgender Curvy Girl” only did it because he was thoroughly investigating how woke culture was destroying the traditional family unit, and for no other reason. He had absolutely no other reason to be cruising transgender Instagram accounts other that to research how evil they were. And he didn't want to corrupt the other staffers, and that's why he did it late at night, and why the door to his office was lock. He also had a cold, which would explain the amount of tissues. And he had dry skin, which explains the hand cream.
Once again, I must thank Hemant for a balanced account of the situation.
The general evidence is that neither the Pastor nor his church has taken anti-LGBT positions. That's unique, considering where his parish is located.
So, while I can be one of the harshest judges of church follies and foibles, give Bubba a pass. He could help with change more than the joy of punishment.
If he’s not damning LGBT people, it’s fine. But I’m not sure that cosplaying a transitioning transgender person is really all that great. Be a cross dresser, that has a long and distinguished history. There’s just something about pretending to be transgender that puts me off, they’ve been demonized so much, and even murdered for being transgender that it gives me the ick. I’m not condemning him, or trying to shame him or anything, but maybe he should think twice about that aspect of what he’s doing if he’s not really transgender. And I’m willing to hear an argument from transgender folks who don’t agree with my take. I’m open to being wrong about it.
The rest of it, he doesn’t deserve to be scrutinized negatively just for dressing as a woman. I dressed up as Ursula for Halloween, it’s just fun to step outside our selves for a while. I’ve dressed as a man on occasion.
“𝐽𝑢𝑠𝑡 𝑚𝑦 𝑤𝑖𝑓𝑒 𝑘𝑛𝑜𝑤𝑠 𝑎𝑏𝑜𝑢𝑡 𝑖𝑡,” 𝐶𝑜𝑝𝑒𝑙𝑎𝑛𝑑 𝑠𝑎𝑖𝑑.
NOT NO MO'!!!
One of the problems with managing a large group of people using fear is that you have to keep that fear going. It needs new targets regularly or it starts to fizzle; living your life afraid all the time takes a lot of energy, and if people have time to stop and think they might start wondering what they were afraid of. Can't have that!
I may well be wrong, but looking at this, what I see is an attempt to keep that fear going. Sure, it's reprehensible and a cheap shot, but that's not the sort of thing that stops some people. What I see is a desperate attempt at "Look! Look! It's even in CHURCHES now!" to try and keep the sheeple in line, because for me, the news over the last month or so has been pretty close to the "All Israel, all the time" channel. (Yes, the war in Israel/Gaza is important, and yes, I want updates. But some of the news has been more than a shade lackluster, and for a while it was all the news talked about for the whole program.) This pastor probably doesn't deserve it, from what I've seen, but he'll wind up suffering for it anyway; if he gets lucky he'll land on his feet so to speak.
So long as the person isn't hurting LGBTQ people, I don't particularly care what he does in his spare time and neither should anyone else.
I suppose the folks in his church might want to talk about whatever erotica he wrote and if it violated their church's teachings, but that's for them to decide.