I've got some scripture about how their god tells them to treat foreigners.
Something along the lines of not mistreating them. Also treating any foreigners in their country as native-born and to love them. Who knew their god was woke?
It absolutely is not okay to fly that flag just because students approved it for the simple reason that rights are not matters of majority rule, and never have been. By that standard those students could outlaw Muslims or any other minority religion they chose. Conservative Christians simply cannot stop trying to force their religion into the public schools paid for with everyone's tax dollars. As a society we do not extend full rights to adolescents for a reason, and this is an example of why.
It's a PUBLIC school. Its attendees and indeed its faculty MAY be Christian. They may also be Jewish, Muslim, Mormon, or even atheist or agnostic. Point being: THEY AREN'T ALL NECESSARILY CHRISTIAN. As such, raising a Christian flag over the school amounts to an act of exclusionism and is utterly inappropriate.
They recognize it and they don't like it. They don't like anything that is different. They especially hate anything that is ambiguous. If it doesn't fit into their tiny boxes, it must be destroyed.
OTOH hand, other people say "It's not your job to fit in a box. That's a cat's job."
Oh, SUPER. Forced proselytism and conversion. Can you imagine how THAT would go over, even among some Christians? If they want to turn things UGLY with a capital "U," that's how.
And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.
But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret; and thy Father which seeth in secret shall reward thee openly. Except in Texas. So sayeth the Laird.
And I was lucky. I only had to deal with rolling blackouts for the first day and then had power the rest of the week. (No water for 3 days, but I had power)
If there had been some sort of student committee that asked to be put in charge of that 3rd flagpole, then maybe it would be ok. But forming the student committee explicitly to control what's on that flagpole? That is de facto school sponsorship, even if not de jure. Will they hoist a pride flag? Probably not.
The best solution, in my opinion, would be 𝗴𝗲𝘁 𝗿𝗶𝗱 𝗼𝗳 𝘁𝗵𝗲 𝗲𝘅𝘁𝗿𝗮 𝗳𝗹𝗮𝗴𝗽𝗼𝗹𝗲.
Show the christian flag to most French people and ask them what it represents. Prepare yourself for a long wait.
The only flag allowed in public schools is the national flag, we don't even have the right to fly regional or cities flags (at least every day, it can be different for some special events).
Whether it's decided by a student council or not, it's still endorsed by a fucking PUBLIC school. We are not talking about a christian club where participation is a voluntary choice but the use of a pole owned by the state/county. The courts were wrong by allowing prayers during graduation speeches for the same reason.
xtians just cant stop waving their dicks (oops) 'flags' around in public. Also, I wonder who the lucky grifter was that sold all those xtian car flags...
This is where we need to fight Christian Nationalism the most. These enclaves of Christianity are not as homogeneous as they claim or want to be, they’re just loud enough to pressure the folks into compliance (if they can’t pressure others out of town completely). Correcting Christian Nationalist creep is easier in the more diverse areas, and even necessary, but the fight really is in these small towns that feed the Nationalism with a majority of almost complete agreement. Shrugging our shoulders and shaking our heads as we say “forget it, Jake, it’s Chinatown” only enables Christian Nationalism to grow and invade more towns and take over our institutions, kind of like the fifth circuit court and the SCOTUS. We’re now fighting on our back foot, but it’s not over.
Having specifically chosen students get together to make decisions you want them to make doesn’t make displaying the Christian flag anything other than the government institution of this public school endorsing a specific branch of Christianity. This flag is not recognized by all sects of Christianity and is not a general statement of “God is good”. Even the tactic of students voting for a student speaker who might say a prayer isn’t as democratic as they make it seem, the school chooses which students to choose from, and I’m sure there are none picked who wouldn’t include a prayer. I’m guessing the highest performing students also attend church. And if there were a student who was a high performer that didn’t attend church, their performance could be easily overlooked because who compares grades in high school. It’s not that competitive and a high performer might just believe they simply missed the cutoff rather than suspecting their politics didn’t fit the desires of the administration for this group.
Nothing about this seems above board and they’re just trying to get away with their Christian Nationalism.
I am frankly amazed that HS students haven't voted to put up a FSM flag or rainbow flag or some other 'political grenade' flag yet. Just because they're high schoolers.
With that in mind, I suspect one of three things is happening:
1. That "under the supervision of a district parent" thing is essentially baking in an illegal content bias.
2. They knew who the "highest GPA" kids were going to be at the time the rule was passed, and they were all conservative Christians.
3. The school is more uniformly christian conservative than any I've ever ever had contact with.
Now while #3 is certainly possible, I'm betting on #1 or #2. If #1, then hopefully secularists can show it and render this illegal. If #2, then I suspect the procedure will be abandoned the first time the "highest gpa" turns over and a Jewish, gay, or heck even just reasonably liberal kid earns that spot.
Yes and if they didn't before, they might now. Consider the scenario they've just created, where there is all sorts of pressure from the principal, school board, and PTA on a teacher to *not* give Billy or Sally that A, because Bill/Sally has said that the first thing they're going to do with their valedictorian status is fly a TST flag on the flagpole.
It's corrupting. Which is kinda the entire point of removing religion from state functions.
I doubt they would have to do anything to keep the GPA low, they just have to choose not to put undesirable kids up for it, I doubt many of the students recognize their standing until close to graduation. The committee is supposedly made up of students from all grades, so how many freshman or even sophomores know where they really stand. And a student who isn’t invested in keeping the flag up, may not even realize they’re being snubbed. A student who is invested in the constitution and is a high performer might have to do some digging to find the injustice.
It's rare for the 'highest GPA' kids to be the type to rock the boat for fear of no or poor recommendations to college admissions boards or even just biased grades from the faculty.
I wasn't quite the highest GPA kid (I took art and I'm mediocre, but it was fun until the asshole in 10th grade prioritized quantity), but I certainly wouldn't have at the time. I *was* one of the two National Merit Scholars the school produced and an Oklahoma Academic All-Stater.
(I feel like I'm bragging, but it is actually relevant to my point.)
Maybe. On the other hand, "I fought the school board and my Principal, and won" makes for a great college essay. Tell me an essay about forcing this district to put up a Pride or TST flag wouldn't play super well to a ton of liberal Universities. They'd eat it up. So I'm not so sure that down the road, there won't be some valedictorian who does exactly this.
When that happens, no doubt the school will respond by changing the procedure. These fundies have no interest in a fair or consistent process; they only care as long as the current process benefits them. When it doesn't, abandon it.
It's sort of a "disrupt the secular OODA-loop" strategy. While we are always trying to come up with a single, long-term, rational process consistent with first amendment religious limits + student speech and expression rights, they flit from temporary process to temporary process. This one's getting challenged? Keep it until just before the court date, then announce you've changed it. The next one is bad in another way and also gets challenged? Keep it going until the court date, then change again. Repeat ad Jesuseum (until Jesus returns).
First, while it is likely there will be *one* who will try, it's unlikely they will succeed. Secondly, my experience has been people who have high grades are focused on their grades not unpopular political crusades. Half of them are just trying to keep their heads down and survive. The other half are at the top of the social ladder and you don't stay there by being different.
What I'm describing is already happening, sort of. When conservative SCOTUS ruled against affirmative action, college-bound High Schoolers started writing essays about their racial experiences. Many of them didn't even want to; they just felt pressure from Universities who they knew *wanted* to include race, but couldn't in any overt manner. So yes, they will focus on political crusades that may be unpopular with the students. It's them trying to read the minds and intents of college admissions staff.
East Jesus Texas parent won’t send her kids to a Christian private school because it costs money for tuition. Since her public school is flying their freak flag for Jesus, why pay for milk when you’re getting the cow for free
Looking at Wikipedia, it doesn’t look like Catholics have adopted the flag, so the SCOTUS, being mostly Catholics, may not allow this. Not that I am confident in this assessment, SCOTUS is making a lot of decisions that only benefit evangelicals and not necessarily Catholic interests. There may be some folks who don’t care for this particular flag at this school.
But "that's democracy". 3 wolves and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. Assuming the sheep accepts the decision of the majority. A written Constitution (or Magna Carta) is supposed to protect the sheep from the wolves, but when wolves are the ones enforcing the "law" it isn't worth the paper it's written on.
Billups: I love Starfleet. Okay, and I don't want to live in a castle with pet dragons and all the mutton I can eat. You need to accept the fact that I'll be a virgin for the rest of my life.
How long until they fly some razor wire from the flagpole?
I hope they use locally sourced razor wire and none of that imported wire from North Dakota.
I've got some scripture about how their god tells them to treat foreigners.
Something along the lines of not mistreating them. Also treating any foreigners in their country as native-born and to love them. Who knew their god was woke?
None left. It's all in the river or along the southern Gulf coast.
Depends, are we talking about Geezuz or Hey-zeus?
👍 for the 𝘋𝘪𝘦 𝘏𝘢𝘳𝘥 𝘸𝘪𝘵𝘩 𝘢 𝘝𝘦𝘯𝘨𝘦𝘢𝘯𝘤𝘦 reference.
If Jesus were to return today (and actually looked like a denizen of the Middle East in the 1st Century) he'd be detained at the airport by TSA.
And then waterboarded.
21st Century baptism.
It absolutely is not okay to fly that flag just because students approved it for the simple reason that rights are not matters of majority rule, and never have been. By that standard those students could outlaw Muslims or any other minority religion they chose. Conservative Christians simply cannot stop trying to force their religion into the public schools paid for with everyone's tax dollars. As a society we do not extend full rights to adolescents for a reason, and this is an example of why.
How about letting the students determine the dress code?
Mandatory halter tops for the girls!
With no bras.
Nothing under the belly button for boys then.
It's a PUBLIC school. Its attendees and indeed its faculty MAY be Christian. They may also be Jewish, Muslim, Mormon, or even atheist or agnostic. Point being: THEY AREN'T ALL NECESSARILY CHRISTIAN. As such, raising a Christian flag over the school amounts to an act of exclusionism and is utterly inappropriate.
Still, this IS Texas, so what do you expect? 😖
Nothing good or reasonable.
That's right. These uber-Christians don't seem to recognize the religious diversity that characterizes our benighted country.
They recognize it and they don't like it. They don't like anything that is different. They especially hate anything that is ambiguous. If it doesn't fit into their tiny boxes, it must be destroyed.
OTOH hand, other people say "It's not your job to fit in a box. That's a cat's job."
> "THEY AREN'T ALL NECESSARILY CHRISTIAN."
...but they should be. ;-)
Oh, SUPER. Forced proselytism and conversion. Can you imagine how THAT would go over, even among some Christians? If they want to turn things UGLY with a capital "U," that's how.
NRA flag?
And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.
But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret; and thy Father which seeth in secret shall reward thee openly. Except in Texas. So sayeth the Laird.
A perfect quote for this situation. Enough with the virtue signaling replacing the hard work of (what should be) Christian principles.
And to Caesar, the things that are Caesar’s.
Not everything. Ask cdbunch about their electrical grid.
And I was lucky. I only had to deal with rolling blackouts for the first day and then had power the rest of the week. (No water for 3 days, but I had power)
If there had been some sort of student committee that asked to be put in charge of that 3rd flagpole, then maybe it would be ok. But forming the student committee explicitly to control what's on that flagpole? That is de facto school sponsorship, even if not de jure. Will they hoist a pride flag? Probably not.
The best solution, in my opinion, would be 𝗴𝗲𝘁 𝗿𝗶𝗱 𝗼𝗳 𝘁𝗵𝗲 𝗲𝘅𝘁𝗿𝗮 𝗳𝗹𝗮𝗴𝗽𝗼𝗹𝗲.
Show the christian flag to most French people and ask them what it represents. Prepare yourself for a long wait.
The only flag allowed in public schools is the national flag, we don't even have the right to fly regional or cities flags (at least every day, it can be different for some special events).
Whether it's decided by a student council or not, it's still endorsed by a fucking PUBLIC school. We are not talking about a christian club where participation is a voluntary choice but the use of a pole owned by the state/county. The courts were wrong by allowing prayers during graduation speeches for the same reason.
xtians just cant stop waving their dicks (oops) 'flags' around in public. Also, I wonder who the lucky grifter was that sold all those xtian car flags...
It's Tex-ass. They're issued at birth.
Bet those flags were made outside the borders of the US, too.
This is where we need to fight Christian Nationalism the most. These enclaves of Christianity are not as homogeneous as they claim or want to be, they’re just loud enough to pressure the folks into compliance (if they can’t pressure others out of town completely). Correcting Christian Nationalist creep is easier in the more diverse areas, and even necessary, but the fight really is in these small towns that feed the Nationalism with a majority of almost complete agreement. Shrugging our shoulders and shaking our heads as we say “forget it, Jake, it’s Chinatown” only enables Christian Nationalism to grow and invade more towns and take over our institutions, kind of like the fifth circuit court and the SCOTUS. We’re now fighting on our back foot, but it’s not over.
Having specifically chosen students get together to make decisions you want them to make doesn’t make displaying the Christian flag anything other than the government institution of this public school endorsing a specific branch of Christianity. This flag is not recognized by all sects of Christianity and is not a general statement of “God is good”. Even the tactic of students voting for a student speaker who might say a prayer isn’t as democratic as they make it seem, the school chooses which students to choose from, and I’m sure there are none picked who wouldn’t include a prayer. I’m guessing the highest performing students also attend church. And if there were a student who was a high performer that didn’t attend church, their performance could be easily overlooked because who compares grades in high school. It’s not that competitive and a high performer might just believe they simply missed the cutoff rather than suspecting their politics didn’t fit the desires of the administration for this group.
Nothing about this seems above board and they’re just trying to get away with their Christian Nationalism.
I'm surprised it's not on the middle pole.
Eta: Yet.
I wonder how the Jewish students in that school feel about the Christian flag?
Or the Hindu students. Or Buddha followers. Or whatever. If possible they probably choose more reasonable schools.
Any religion...nine-tenths of the world are NOT Evangelical Christians.
As for me, let's not forget the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster. Or Satanism.
They are probably resigned to it since they live in a christofascist area.
Jewish STUDENT... maybe.
In that part of the world...yeah.
I am frankly amazed that HS students haven't voted to put up a FSM flag or rainbow flag or some other 'political grenade' flag yet. Just because they're high schoolers.
With that in mind, I suspect one of three things is happening:
1. That "under the supervision of a district parent" thing is essentially baking in an illegal content bias.
2. They knew who the "highest GPA" kids were going to be at the time the rule was passed, and they were all conservative Christians.
3. The school is more uniformly christian conservative than any I've ever ever had contact with.
Now while #3 is certainly possible, I'm betting on #1 or #2. If #1, then hopefully secularists can show it and render this illegal. If #2, then I suspect the procedure will be abandoned the first time the "highest gpa" turns over and a Jewish, gay, or heck even just reasonably liberal kid earns that spot.
Likely a combination of 1 and 2. I expect the teachers to conspire to prevent an "unacceptable" kid from achieving the highest gpa.
Yes and if they didn't before, they might now. Consider the scenario they've just created, where there is all sorts of pressure from the principal, school board, and PTA on a teacher to *not* give Billy or Sally that A, because Bill/Sally has said that the first thing they're going to do with their valedictorian status is fly a TST flag on the flagpole.
It's corrupting. Which is kinda the entire point of removing religion from state functions.
Didn't a couple of guys named Jim and Tom mention that in some.letters a few years back?
That kid would be outvoted by the other members of the committee.
I doubt they would have to do anything to keep the GPA low, they just have to choose not to put undesirable kids up for it, I doubt many of the students recognize their standing until close to graduation. The committee is supposedly made up of students from all grades, so how many freshman or even sophomores know where they really stand. And a student who isn’t invested in keeping the flag up, may not even realize they’re being snubbed. A student who is invested in the constitution and is a high performer might have to do some digging to find the injustice.
It's rare for the 'highest GPA' kids to be the type to rock the boat for fear of no or poor recommendations to college admissions boards or even just biased grades from the faculty.
I wasn't quite the highest GPA kid (I took art and I'm mediocre, but it was fun until the asshole in 10th grade prioritized quantity), but I certainly wouldn't have at the time. I *was* one of the two National Merit Scholars the school produced and an Oklahoma Academic All-Stater.
(I feel like I'm bragging, but it is actually relevant to my point.)
Maybe. On the other hand, "I fought the school board and my Principal, and won" makes for a great college essay. Tell me an essay about forcing this district to put up a Pride or TST flag wouldn't play super well to a ton of liberal Universities. They'd eat it up. So I'm not so sure that down the road, there won't be some valedictorian who does exactly this.
When that happens, no doubt the school will respond by changing the procedure. These fundies have no interest in a fair or consistent process; they only care as long as the current process benefits them. When it doesn't, abandon it.
It's sort of a "disrupt the secular OODA-loop" strategy. While we are always trying to come up with a single, long-term, rational process consistent with first amendment religious limits + student speech and expression rights, they flit from temporary process to temporary process. This one's getting challenged? Keep it until just before the court date, then announce you've changed it. The next one is bad in another way and also gets challenged? Keep it going until the court date, then change again. Repeat ad Jesuseum (until Jesus returns).
First, while it is likely there will be *one* who will try, it's unlikely they will succeed. Secondly, my experience has been people who have high grades are focused on their grades not unpopular political crusades. Half of them are just trying to keep their heads down and survive. The other half are at the top of the social ladder and you don't stay there by being different.
What I'm describing is already happening, sort of. When conservative SCOTUS ruled against affirmative action, college-bound High Schoolers started writing essays about their racial experiences. Many of them didn't even want to; they just felt pressure from Universities who they knew *wanted* to include race, but couldn't in any overt manner. So yes, they will focus on political crusades that may be unpopular with the students. It's them trying to read the minds and intents of college admissions staff.
Helpful hint: if you cut the first 1/4th or so off your Christian flag, it'll be more useful!
Y'know.
For when you finally lose your bullshit culture war and need something to surrender with.
Rip it into strips about 4" wide and put perforations about every 4". Then roll it up on a tube.
And then stuff it up their own ass?
East Jesus Texas parent won’t send her kids to a Christian private school because it costs money for tuition. Since her public school is flying their freak flag for Jesus, why pay for milk when you’re getting the cow for free
🙄
Her party loves to destroy public education. What's she gonna do if public schools in Texass vanish? Talk about cutting one's own throat
Jonestown.
Get out the Flavor Aid.
A tyranny of the majority is the point.
Looking at Wikipedia, it doesn’t look like Catholics have adopted the flag, so the SCOTUS, being mostly Catholics, may not allow this. Not that I am confident in this assessment, SCOTUS is making a lot of decisions that only benefit evangelicals and not necessarily Catholic interests. There may be some folks who don’t care for this particular flag at this school.
A student committee? Putting the rights of others to a vote? No, damn it.
I have the sneaking suspicion that they would like to redefine human rights as Christian rights.
But "that's democracy". 3 wolves and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. Assuming the sheep accepts the decision of the majority. A written Constitution (or Magna Carta) is supposed to protect the sheep from the wolves, but when wolves are the ones enforcing the "law" it isn't worth the paper it's written on.
Mmmm... mutton. Dinner is served!
Billups: I love Starfleet. Okay, and I don't want to live in a castle with pet dragons and all the mutton I can eat. You need to accept the fact that I'll be a virgin for the rest of my life.
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt9207552/?ref_=ttep_ep7