473 Comments

Trust at an all time low. Well, gee whiz! You've only got priests and pastors diddling both children and adults, you've got them running illicit monetary schemes to bilk their congregants out of even more money than they tithe, never mind opining politically from the pulpit, mostly about stuff they know NOTHING about. Meanwhile, the internet provides a means for the intelligent attendee to examine and analyze all of the above and possibly come to the conclusion that someone is very full of meadow muffins.

Offhand, I'd say that the title of this article is all but intuitively obvious.

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And they're 'fluffers' for Trump MAGA rallies! Go figure.

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"Meadow muffins." LOL

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So a profession's who fundamental tenet, that there is a god, is a lie, are not as honest as they think they are? I am shocked!

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Theology is the study which has yet to prove that its subject matter exists.

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Theology is philosophy's idiot cousin.

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I think it more likely for many that they believe God is real and the importance of their own role gives them moral cover for their failings.

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(Similar dynamic with politicians or their followers justifying their misbehavior in service to the higher good.)

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Well, there's a good reason for that:

1. We have rabbis who sell body parts.

2. Protestant pastors who run real estate development schemes disguised as churches (to avoid the IRS).

3. Televangelists who grift for money to pay for private jets, air-conditioned dog houses, prostitutes, and to pay off church secretaries they bopped.

4. Catholic priests who molest little children and get away with it.

5. Muslim imams who tell their flock to commit suicide bombings, but stay safe in their compound in Pakistan.

6. Mormon leaders who tell us it is glorious to get rich and be gay-bashing racists.

7. Buddhist monks who say everything is as it should be.

That leaves the Flying Spaghetti Monster and five pitchers: Don Larsen, David Wells, David Cone, Domingo German, and Matt Cain. They pitched Perfect Games for my two favorite teams, the New York Yankees and the San Francisco Giants. 27 up, 27 down. Can't do better than that.

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Feb 9·edited Feb 9

Don't forget the Perfect Phone Call. Donald Trump to Volodymyr Zelenskyy.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/11/11/politics/donald-trump-biden-ukraine-call/index.html

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Jibbers Crabst pitched a one pitch game, that pitch exploded the visiting dugout.

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Well, that doesn't count...unless he was a Giant or a Yankee.

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Most people think Jibbers is from Maine, but he's not he's from Long Island Sound, a giant New York Lobster.

⁽⁠⁽⁠ଘ⁠(⁠ ⁠ˊ⁠ᵕ⁠ˋ⁠ ⁠)⁠ଓ⁠⁾⁠⁾

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Sounds fishy to me.

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I wouldn't pay a fin for that story.

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How about a sawbuck?

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Trust has to be earned.

If most pastors and Christians acted like Fred Rogers or Jimmy Carter, I'm sure that number would be a lot higher.

But they don't. They act like Fred Phelps and Jimmy Swaggart.

You reap what you sow.

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Minimal music. Nice

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Yeah, but I couldn't make out the lyrics.

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Almost like a Gregorian chant

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"If you’re looking for ethics and morals, you’re not about to find them in a local church."

We know this. It's about time the general population has begun to realize it.

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I think there is a new awareness of and interest in identifying abusive behaviors among the public. We are identifying behaviors that in the past were normal and wide spread that are not healthy. We’ve made steps towards identifying and stopping things like bullying, spanking, and gaslighting, which allow folks to create and maintain boundaries. As we become more enlightened about what abuse is, we find that the clergy have their own special ways of perpetrating it. Perhaps folks aren’t ready to see the religion in the light of abuse, but it’s is difficult to ignore the preacher when he gaslights you about the Bible. Or they bully you into participating in activities, speak about others in ways that are not apparent.

And there’s also the epidemic of clergy sexual abuse.

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My guess is that the more widely publicized abuse, sex, and financial scandals, and the descent of evangelicalism into political authoritarianism, have changed the cultural assumptions about the clergy. There are lots of ethical clergy just as there are lots of ethical lawyers and car sales people. But the cultural default assumption about the clergy has shifted.

My own experience around church pastors has been like my experience around politicians. They can have the highest personal ethics but I still usually don’t enjoy being around them, for mostly the same reasons.

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Regarding the question, are Pastor's ethical? The answer is, some are and some aren't, just like every other walk of life. That said, what is different about the clergy is they way they set themselves up to be moral leaders, but defining morality is like nailing Jello to the ceiling. The sincere Pastors are most often people whose judgment is compromised by special pleading and magical thinking which makes ethical considerations hard to evaluate. The extent to which I care about clerical ethics comes down to the people they harm in the name of their religion.

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I agree. The problem is the good ones aren't very vocal in opposition to the bad ones (religious leaders). Loyalty is a powerful trait, it often overrides all other ideology. And when there's a power imbalance, it's a one-way street.

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OT- Never meet your heroes... especially if they're villains: https://www.meidastouch.com/news/tucker-gets-used-abused-by-his-daddy-vlady

Noted putz and poster-boy for resting constipation face Tucker Carlson landed his dream interview with Vlad the Vampire himself... and Tucker's going to be walking funny for a while after Vlad stuck his arm all the way up Tucker's pucker and used him as a hand-puppet for two hours running. Putin pretty much just told his "interviewer" to zip it, then spent most of the production presenting his own version of the 𝘛𝘳𝘶𝘦 𝘈𝘶𝘵𝘩𝘦𝘯𝘵𝘪𝘤 𝘛𝘰𝘵𝘢𝘭𝘭𝘺 𝘍𝘢𝘤𝘵𝘶𝘢𝘭 𝘏𝘪𝘴𝘵𝘰𝘳𝘺 𝘰𝘧 𝘔𝘰𝘵𝘩𝘦𝘳 𝘙𝘶𝘴𝘴𝘪𝘢 to Comrade Carlson's loyal viewers. Putin went on to proudly confirm every last criticism that's been leveled against him throughout the last several years of war crimes, despite Tucker's repeated attempts to make him look like 𝘦𝘷𝘦𝘯 𝘴𝘭𝘪𝘨𝘩𝘵𝘭𝘺 𝘭𝘦𝘴𝘴 of a monster. The best part? The little weasel can't even try to spin it for his fashy fans back home, because the Kremlin refused to even let the interview happen unless it was aired 𝘶𝘯𝘦𝘥𝘪𝘵𝘦𝘥.

Too funny. Tucker boldly sallied forth to lionize a brutal dictator... and got brutalized himself, instead.

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𝐖𝐡𝐲 𝐌𝐀𝐆𝐀 𝐋𝐨𝐯𝐞𝐬 𝐑𝐮𝐬𝐬𝐢𝐚 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐇𝐚𝐭𝐞𝐬 𝐔𝐤𝐫𝐚𝐢𝐧𝐞

https://dnyuz.com/2024/02/08/why-maga-loves-russia-and-hates-ukraine/

by David French

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Slava Ukraini!

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Thanks for sharing. An amazing article. "Bespoke realities." Love it.

I like the "flawed heroes" concept. It certainly fits christian doctrine. What they don't realize is if heroes are flawed and the greater the flaw the greater the hero, then jesus should have been the most horrific person in existence.

As I read the article, it made me think of Star Trek 6 in which bad actors on both sides allied to stoke war because the old and terrible ways were familiar (and lucrative). Now, we have people pining for the "good ol' days" of the 1950s: open racism, beating your wife and children were "domestic issues not requiring outside involvement" and, of course, the good old Cold War with its Red Scare and constant funding of secret war machines, aka the CIA.

The Strong Horse Theory is a theory of why there is a constant state of conflict war in the Middle East. It posits that people prefer the strong horse over the weak horse and so will follow a strong leader regardless of ideological differences. People's fleeting "loyalty" will hop from strong leader to strong leader with each successive transition. I think it's very applicable to the right. I also wonder how many school bullies wind up conservative.

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Carlson didn't learn his lesson when he got his ass handed to him by Jon Stewart on CNNs "Crossfire" back in 2004. Carlson's bow tie was spinning so rapidly he looked like he was taxiing out to the runway.

This was back when he had a REAL platform to work on, not the godawful X/Bird app he "interviewed" Mad Vlad on.

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CARLSON (to Stewart, on Crossfire): "I thought you'd be funnier."

STEWART: "I'm not gonna be your monkey."

Classic!

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That reminds me of what I said to consewertives over at the TBT. I called them mental amoebas, then an hour later, I posted an apology to all amoebas, past, present, and future, for comparing repukes to them.

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Fucker Carlson: Putin's other cock holster.

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OT -

𝐈𝐧 𝐑𝐞𝐝 𝐒𝐭𝐚𝐭𝐞𝐬, 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐁𝐢𝐥𝐥 𝐟𝐨𝐫 𝐒𝐜𝐡𝐨𝐨𝐥 𝐕𝐨𝐮𝐜𝐡𝐞𝐫 𝐁𝐚𝐢𝐭-𝐚𝐧𝐝-𝐒𝐰𝐢𝐭𝐜𝐡 𝐈𝐬 𝐂𝐨𝐦𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐃𝐮𝐞

In Arizona, taxpayers are now staring down a $400 million shortfall, with an even bigger bill coming due next year. How did the Grand Canyon State go from sitting on a huge cash reserve to facing a rising tide of red ink? Simple. Voucher proponents suggested that paying for private school tuition would cost taxpayers $65 million a year; but as it stands, the program is on track to cost roughly 15 times that. All told, Arizona taxpayers are likely to spend close to a billion dollars reimbursing the cost of tuition and luxury expenses—including ski resort passes, pianos, and theme park tickets—for families whose children were never enrolled in the public schools.

https://www.thenation.com/article/society/school-vouchers-red-state-budgets/

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I know history is a bad word for conservatives but one of USA wealthiest period was also one with the highest tax rates, j'dis ça j'dis rien.

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It was also the time when the middle class was flourishing. Reagan all but destroyed the middle class with his trickle-down bullshit.

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Consider this, I know next to nothing about USA history and yet.

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The thing is, though, you are interested and give a damn. I shudder to think about the number of my fellow Americans who can't be bothered. 🤦‍♂️

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When I was in HS, we never got much past the Civil War, maybe Reconstruction in American History.

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Feb 9·edited Feb 9

In HS, we had one class called American History: I880 - 1950.

Got an 🅰➕

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As I recall, our US History course was pretty thorough. I still remember writing a paper on the 1952 presidential election between Eisenhower and Stevenson. Then, too, New Trier in north suburban Illinois was (and I think still is) a pretty highly ranked school.

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When I was, it was the reverse. WW1 & 2 in 8th and 9th grade, again in BEP (High school diploma, 2 years), again in BAC pro (same as BEP, higher diploma). I didn't even review anything for my last history exam and got a 16/20.

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Most Americans couldn't tell you who the leaders of our two largest trading partners are...or which nations those happen to be.

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I know we export a lot of money to China.

My other guess would be someplace with child sweat shops, but there's too many to pick from.

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Mexico and Canada. Do I get a No-Prize?

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The best way to raise a child in the USA is to give them an ax and expect them to tell the truth about what they did with it.

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Washington or Borden style ?

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That Lizzie. She was a real cut-up.

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Where are you at? We obviously didn't colonize you well enough. We need to rectify that.

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Sorry but gochujang is way more appetising than ketchup.

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Bill Mahar (back before he became a right-wing asshole) said it succinctly, "They're telling you they're pissing on you."

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Reaganomics, aka supply side/voodoo economics has failed every single time it has been applied.

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You know what is said about failed social experiments "If you prey hard enough, it will work for you."

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I respectfully disagree. It worked as intended.

The rich got richer.

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Yep 90% on income over $200,000, 1944-1963

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But that $200k was back when millionaires were rich. Now a million is a 3 bedroom in half of California.

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Yep. When I retired I sold my house for a ridiculous sum and downsized back to the PNW. Will never be able to afford to go back even if I wanted to.

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Tell that to people on disability, trying to eat while being told you make too much money for food assistance because you get $18,000 a year in SSDI...

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By that standard someone who makes $50k a year is rich. The point is that a millionaire is still middle class today and doesn't qualify as rich in the usual sense of the word.

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I recommend the book American Public Education and the Responsibilities of Its Citizens. It's a bit drier reading, being more scholarly, but it's very informative. And when these charter schools fail (and some have), the students are dumped back on the public education system and are obligated to take them, sans the money that was pulled to fund the charter schools, which just dilutes public education even more.

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"Can the profession do anything to regain trust?"

I was going to say "Get a honest job", but then they wouldn't be clergy.

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Making a living off false consolation and lies and pretending your morality exceeds that of anybody else is quite an amazing cognitive dissonance.

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"A virgin can conceive. A dead body can walk again. Your leprosy can be cured. The blind can see. It's not moral to lie to children. It's not moral to lie to ignorant, uneducated people and tell them that if they would only believe nonsense, they can be saved. It's immoral."

-- Christopher Hitchens

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From The Mind of Adolph Hitler:

His primary rules were: never allow the public to cool off; never admit a fault or wrong; never concede that there may be some good in your enemy; never leave room for alternatives; never accept blame; concentrate on one enemy at a time and blame him for everything that goes wrong; people will believe a big lie sooner than a little one; and if you repeat it frequently enough people will sooner or later believe it.

Sound like anybody leading the Republican party who less than a plurality of stupid Americans voted in as President in 2016?

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Sounds like Trump to a tee

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That's a time-test plan that has worked every single time.

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"If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it."

--Joseph Goebbels

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It’s dangerous to perform a magic trick and tell the audience what happened is real. Could get a fellow crucified.

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I seriously doubt the feel uncomfortable by that at all.

What is cognitive dissonance?

When someone tells a lie and feels uncomfortable about it because he fundamentally sees himself as an honest person, he may be experiencing cognitive dissonance. That is, there is mental discord related to a contradiction between one thought (in this case, knowing he did something wrong) and another (thinking that he is honest).

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/basics/cognitive-dissonance

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Intra-species predators such as sociopaths are not burdened by dissonant thinking. They will tell a lie when they don’t need too. Even in front of their wife Morgan Fairchild.

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Jack Calmes?

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Feb 9·edited Feb 9

They have a Cognitive Dissonance Deficiency. The Biden Administration has asked the NIH to fund $4.36 billion in rodent studies to learn the mechanism. It's Biden's Delusional Disorders Moonshot, to complement the $6.81 Trillion he wants to spend for his Cancer Moonshot.

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I guess you are right, they are completely indifferent to telling lies.

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I'm not against people making money off of selling fiction. However, I'm kind of against claiming that fiction is fact and using it to make people commit atrocities.

But, apparently, too many people aren't.

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Tomorrow's news: Republicans try to ban Gallup for "cancelling" Christianity.

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Feb 9·edited Feb 12

Adults who insist their imaginary friend is real and you’re moral failure if you don’t accept that, and go on to insist their imaginary friend says men get to control women and gay people are bad because reasons, and by the way they’ll be needing a cut of your paycheck going forward, should have a great deal of trouble earning anyone’s trust.

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Ethics go out the window when one is part of a mindset that gives them a blank check to engage in any sort of behavior they deem fit. This includes not just pastors but the laity as well. It is an inherently broken system that has seen its proponents commit atrocities in the name of their oh-so-convenient phantasms.

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Most pastors, like republicans and Christians have about as much integrity as you can get into the left eye of a blind mosquito.

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