309 Comments

Ms Zelaya: "You are bigoted assholes, I quit."

Houghton University: "You can't quit. You're fired for calling us what we are."

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They were already rid of her, but just couldn't accept not getting the last word in. How thoroughly petty of them...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-m34GUn0QqA

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Well, she was on her way out the door, but had another month... until said letter where she was all but banned from campus.

I do wonder about the evidence Mr. Wilmot was fired for use of pronouns (not that I doubt it, but rather "the smoking gun") Ms. Zelaya also had the "presumption" to publicly criticize the school and tell it that it was behaving badly.

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Salut toi ๐Ÿ™‚

Did you have a good road trip ?

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For the most part, yes. There were a couple of things I didn't really get to see so I may go back (by plane ๐Ÿ˜€)

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Yep, the urge to humiliate and thumb their nose at someone who has dared disagreed with them. Not just by grabbing said persons already on their way out merely to boot them out the door in the most hateful and petty way possible, but the treat them as if they are literally lepers. I'm surprised that hateful epistle didn't require them to shout "Unclean! Unclean!" every time they set foot back on campus for the next few weeks.

Admin could have just waited quietly and allowed the "problem"to go away on its own, but nooooooooooooo. Gotta show 'em just Who's In Charge and treat them like shit.

Way to go, christians. No wonder so many normies hate your guts.

Have the cries of "persecution!" in response to the youtube video begun yet?

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I especially liked the detail that meals had to be โ€œto goโ€, like she has cooties.

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Hey, now she can get unemployment.

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Having been let go a time or two, it depends upon whether it was โ€œfor causeโ€ (at least in my state). The ex-employer can contest the filing for benefits. These Christians are assholes enough that I wouldnโ€™t put it past them.

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This is a great illustration of how the right is latching onto some outlier thing to actively hurt a vulnerable minority while repercussions affect a larger portion of the population (generally women, especially women of color) and they don't seem to care but rather find it an added benefit to the harm they are actively causing.

This is about the transgender community and they are the intended victims and we should address it simply for that reason. The professional purpose of the pronouns is for those folks with unusual or gender neutral names, and the school was happy to other these folks over that even if they do fit in the schoolโ€™s mistaken idea of a gender binary. Recently in womenโ€™s sports, the right has attacked transgender women for wanting to participate, but they have been actively attacking women who succeed in the sports anyway because they do not conform to the โ€œideal feminine standardโ€ mainly because the athletes build muscle. Look at the Williams sisters, they are accused of being transgender, or just men who are pretending to be women without seeking transgender medical care, because they are muscular and super successful. Michelle Obama got it too. Women have been accosted in bathrooms for being men in disguise because they donโ€™t conform, it has happened in my presence. The right is fine with these โ€œmistakesโ€ because they are part of the purpose. Thereโ€™s a lot of bigotry involved in this type of attacks. Many facets of misogyny, racism, homophobia and transphobia. All of this is intended consequences.

This school takes issue with any perceived support of transgender people, these two professors have names (and skin in Ms. Zelayaโ€™s case) that donโ€™t conform to the schoolโ€™s white supremacy, she pointed out the bigotry the school is trying to cover up and they found a way to prove her right while causing her and their target du jour harm. I think the other professor was just caught in the crossfire because the school thought enough about what they were doing to know that firing her for the pronouns and not anyone else who uses them, they would not win a lawsuit. So they picked someone who also had a foreign sounding name, was male (avoid the sexism accusation) and was known for advocacy, perhaps he had done something in the past or was not liked by some administrator for some reason to even be on their radar. Not that I think the school would even face a lawsuit since Christian schools get special treatment for firing folks for ridiculous reasons.

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May 22, 2023ยทedited May 22, 2023

There are essentially zero transgender people in my professional circle, yet I still see the pronoun thing as fine. As you say, as Hemant said, and as anyone should realize, in a multicultural world where it's not obvious what pronoun goes with an unfamiliar or unusual name, this provides an easy way to avoid a faux pas.

Now if I could only get my co-workers to also use their titles and include their .sig on their replies, I wouldn't have to hunt through tons of emails to find someone's phone number or know how to title them in meeting minutes etc.

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In my position I deal with a lot of customers who really should use a signature and provide any hint of pronouns. I sell medical supplies and get emails with just first names from all over the world and I cannot tell you how confused I get. And thereโ€™s rarely a phone number which is necessary for processing their orders.

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Okay maโ€™am.

Take me to the gulag.

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So if we abolish pronouns everybody will just call you asshole instead of you?

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Fun Fact: for many years, the Navy was convinced I'm a guy.

Someone's given name is about the absolute worst criteria to determine gender on. Names change gender all to often anyway, to say nothing of the exceptions that happen more frequently than one might assume. Including the correct pronoun of address is a professional courtesy that should be used more often not just to help others, to also to help ensure that communications reach the correct individual, and that applies regardless of the relative 'gender' of a given name. Also: the whole world does not, in fact, usually use the Given/Middle/Family set up most of the US and chunks of Europe are familiar with, the 'first' name given might well be a family name that would be the same regardless of gender.

Cultural awareness isn't about making sure the whole world dances to your tune, it's about learning about people who are different from you and respecting who they are. They aren't going to dance to your tune just because you're Christian, grow up and try to pretend you're an adult, mmmkay?

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In the French version of Lucifer Carmen became Carlos because here this name is only for women ๐Ÿ™„

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I have worked with 2 people named Kimberly. The first was a large man who could have beaten any three people combined in a fight. The second was a small woman who would have no compunctions about kicking a man in the crotch to win a fight.

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Carol, Kelly, Carrie, Kim, Michel, were all male names for some time and have switched relatively recently. Thatโ€™s just off the top of my head.

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I have a male cousin named Carry.

I also had one named Garry.

My Dad and his two brothers thought it was clever to have sons with rhyming names.

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Grant would have been more funny, especially for family reunion's meals.

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But that would leave me out. Unless Cary Grant's middle name was Larry.

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Michel is for men, Michelle/Michรจle for women.

Historically, Anne* et Camille were for both gender, now Anne is only for girls/women and Camille is rare for boys/men.

* Anne de Montmorency and Anne de Pisseleu lived at the same time.

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My father and brother were both Francis, with an i. It is also a popular name in my mother's family, but no girls named Frances...

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Some if not all of those are still male names, when you get outside of US/UK culture.

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I could write dozens of names that I've heard for both males and females. I have to wait until I see them (and sometimes not even then!) to know "what" they are. Like it matters.

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If some French people googled Courtney B. Vance they would be surprised.

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A friend of mine, Lyndon, reported to the draft board for the physical. For some strange reason, ๐ฌ๐ก๐ž was rejected. ๐Ÿค”

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Why do jerks like you have such trouble following the "golden rule"? You know, the one that goes "do unto others as you would have them do unto you". Not "behave like the overweight, indicted, racist, sexist, moronic asshole who paints his skin orange because he thinks it makes him look like he's covered in gold".

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Poor Benjy. Opens his mouth and sticks both feet in.

Must've been hard for him type like that. Fortunately, he won't have to worry about it anymore because he got the hammer.

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https://youtu.be/9P4ex4C7wtI

Lemmy forever!

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The first Motorhead LP I ever bought. It would not be the last.

(Met Lemmy back in the 80s. The man is like unto a god)

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Private Christian school pulls bigoted crap. To coin a phrase: "We are not amused."

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Or surprised. ๐Ÿ˜

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My surprised face: -_-

At this point, it seems more like it's expected.

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May 22, 2023ยทedited May 22, 2023

OT- Don the Con proves unable to hold tongue; victim asks the court to hold it for him: https://apnews.com/article/trump-rape-trial-carroll-536e9f38e84f42d53b0216293b848e08

Cheetolini's entirely predictable televised tantrum over the verdict in the E Jean Carroll case looks like it will come back to bite him on the ample posterior, as Carroll has now amended her ๐˜ฐ๐˜ต๐˜ฉ๐˜ฆ๐˜ณ pending defamation suit to include remarks made during CNN's shitshow of a "town hall." May he continue to talk himself out of the ill-gotten gains he was always so proud of- I can't imagine anything more offensive to him than becoming ๐˜ฑ๐˜ฐ๐˜ฐ๐˜ณ.

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If only she could collect the money. If he hands over any, I'll believe it when I see it. It's not as if it's hush money anymore is it?

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He only believes in defamation when someone says something true about him.

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Well, at least without a fairy godmother to make him *gasp* black.

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LOL! Just wish the mouth looked a little more sphincter-ish, like IRL.

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"if the school doesnโ€™t embrace different kinds of diversity, they shouldnโ€™t pretend otherwise"

I can't imagine the school (or any other christian/conservative institution) would admit it, but that's standard practice in Murrica. Statements endorsing diversity,and even nondiscrimination policies, make for great PR (and not coincidentally they frequently conform with local/state law.) But PR campaigns don't always reflect actual practices; maybe even not *often*. We've seen one story after another of companies and even municipal entities and *churches* that flout their own "commitment to diversity" and "support for minority rights."

I've personally experienced this. Back in the 90s, to supplement my writing income, I took a job with a litigation support company called Aspen Systems (now defunct). The company amassed, organized and indexed/cross-referenced enormous databases of documents for use in corporate lawsuits. (I was in charge of a team working on the suits against Hooker Chemical/Occidental centering on the Love Canal.) The company's employee handbook explicitly cited their nondiscrimination policy for LGBT employees--which was good for me to know, because I was also actively involved in getting Pittsburgh's gay rights law passed (media gigs, newspaper interviews, etc.)

After I'd been there for a year or so, they hired a new facility manager. She was thin, nervous and paranoid (we joked that she looked like Don Knotts in drag.) And she was a conservative christian. Exactly one day after the gay rights law passed, she called me into her office, told me that the fact I'm gay is "offensive to people," and demoted me from management. Yep, she did it AFTER the law passed; clever, huh? Two weeks later she fired me outright.

Needless to say, I sued. And--get this--friends who still worked there told me they reissued the employee handbook DELETING that pesky nondiscrimination policy. Can you say "own goal"? There may be people who've won lawsuits more easily, but I'm not aware of them.

To get back to where I started, enlightened statements and policies are quite frequently nothing but PR window dressing, good for business but inconvenient for conservative institutions to back up. We can safely add Houghton to the list.

P.S. That former manager of mine was some piece of work. Within three months of starting on the job, she had SIX discrimination suits filed against her, two by gay men, two by black men and two by black women. Some record, huh?

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So which job did she end up taking in the tRump maladministration?

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Offhand, I'd guess she was hauled off to the laughing academy long before that.

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Psychiatrists needed more guinea... patients ?

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And Ron DeSantis is right there to tell them what they're doing is both legal and morally justifiable.

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I can't understand why his head hasn't exploded already, with all the hate and rage he crams in there. Maybe one of these days.....

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Did you take too large a dose of your antipsychotic meds or too small?

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Once again you misspelled "concentration camp."

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His idiocy cost him.

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Ugh. She sounds like somebody I used to know. BTW, loved the "Don Knotts in drag" bit!

:-D

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Next up, banning English classes for teaching pronouns (c'mon, we all know it's only a matter of time before someone tries it).

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Don't give Ron DaNazi any ideas.

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Are you sure a religious private school didn't already banned them ?

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Or, as Jesus said, "Love thy neighbor as thyself, but if you can't manage it, go ahead and be an asshole."

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That's REPUBLICAN Jesus to you, heathen.

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'Murican Jesus.

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Mublican.

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They prefer to be known as *Trumpublicans*. ๐Ÿ˜‰

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May 22, 2023ยทedited May 22, 2023

That subset I like to call MAGAts.

What I especially enjoy are the people who still call themselves Republicans, say they hate Trump, and say that they would never vote for a Democrat. So either they voted for Trump or completely threw away their vote.

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May 22, 2023ยทedited May 22, 2023

Houghton recently reached out to the DeSantis administration for guidance writing its new Homogeneity, Inequality and Exclusion policy.

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You misspelled DeNazi.

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founding

These two people are remarkably articulate and earnest, and the students have suffered a very sad loss at the hands of their school's calcified administration.

The word "university" comes from Old French univers (12c.), from Latin universum "all things, everybody, all people, the whole world," noun use of neuter of adjective universus "all together, all in one, whole, entire, relating to all,"

Apparently, Houghton "University" does not mean the open, inclusive-sounding thrust of the word. They want to be their students' "universe" as in a closed, completely self-contained dimension that only contains beings that they approve of.

Okay, keep on contracting your little universe, squeezing out the creative, diverse, expressive, thoughtful, and honest denizens until you achieve perfect uniformity, unvarying cookie-cutter students who will never question your narrow party line. Meanwhile, the rest of the world will continue to expand and include, and thereby strengthen and prosper.

Sooner than the administrators think, the growing mismatch and irelevelance between the "University" and the world surrounding it will result in its extinction.

Christianity continues its steady and determined self-destruction.

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Sin is the cudgel used by religion to pound hatred into the hearts of its followers.

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May 22, 2023ยทedited May 22, 2023

To Nancy Stanley at Houghton U. over the termination Raegan and Shua for using their pronouns:

"Let us make man in our image, after our likeness."

*AHEM!*

(OK, so "our" isn't normally considered a pronoun. But "us" is)

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Christian apologists would have us believe they have the dead-certain truth when it comes to just about everything, and yet they're terrified of pronouns. This action speaks directly to just how weak the Christian argument really is.

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From Umberto Eco's essay "Ur-Fascism": "๐˜ˆ๐˜ญ๐˜ญ ๐˜ต๐˜ฉ๐˜ฆ ๐˜•๐˜ข๐˜ป๐˜ช ๐˜ฐ๐˜ณ ๐˜๐˜ข๐˜ด๐˜ค๐˜ช๐˜ด๐˜ต ๐˜ด๐˜ค๐˜ฉ๐˜ฐ๐˜ฐ๐˜ญ๐˜ฃ๐˜ฐ๐˜ฐ๐˜ฌ๐˜ด ๐˜ฎ๐˜ข๐˜ฌ๐˜ฆ ๐˜ถ๐˜ด๐˜ฆ ๐˜ฐ๐˜ง ๐˜ข๐˜ฏ ๐˜ช๐˜ฎ๐˜ฑ๐˜ฐ๐˜ท๐˜ฆ๐˜ณ๐˜ช๐˜ด๐˜ฉ๐˜ฆ๐˜ฅ ๐˜ท๐˜ฐ๐˜ค๐˜ข๐˜ฃ๐˜ถ๐˜ญ๐˜ข๐˜ณ๐˜บ, ๐˜ข๐˜ฏ๐˜ฅ ๐˜ข๐˜ฏ ๐˜ฆ๐˜ญ๐˜ฆ๐˜ฎ๐˜ฆ๐˜ฏ๐˜ต๐˜ข๐˜ณ๐˜บ ๐˜ด๐˜บ๐˜ฏ๐˜ต๐˜ข๐˜น, ๐˜ช๐˜ฏ ๐˜ฐ๐˜ณ๐˜ฅ๐˜ฆ๐˜ณ ๐˜ต๐˜ฐ ๐˜ญ๐˜ช๐˜ฎ๐˜ช๐˜ต ๐˜ต๐˜ฉ๐˜ฆ ๐˜ช๐˜ฏ๐˜ด๐˜ต๐˜ณ๐˜ถ๐˜ฎ๐˜ฆ๐˜ฏ๐˜ต๐˜ด ๐˜ง๐˜ฐ๐˜ณ ๐˜ค๐˜ฐ๐˜ฎ๐˜ฑ๐˜ญ๐˜ฆ๐˜น ๐˜ข๐˜ฏ๐˜ฅ ๐˜ค๐˜ณ๐˜ช๐˜ต๐˜ช๐˜ค๐˜ข๐˜ญ ๐˜ณ๐˜ฆ๐˜ข๐˜ด๐˜ฐ๐˜ฏ๐˜ช๐˜ฏ๐˜จ."

The fact that one person clarifies their identity by appending their pronouns might offer others the ๐˜ช๐˜ฎ๐˜ฑ๐˜ญ๐˜ช๐˜ค๐˜ข๐˜ต๐˜ช๐˜ฐ๐˜ฏ that other identities are possible- and, in order to prevent such thinking, the practice cannot be allowed. Tyranny craves simplicity, for the simple are easiest to control.

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You can read? Quelle surprise!

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Even if he can read it doesn't mean he can comprehend. Two different things. :)

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In the final analysis, they're a bunch of scared little kids who want to bully those that maybe won't fight back.

The subsequent fallout from this will be possibly interesting, I suspect.

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Christian School Does Stupid Christian Stuff; Water Is Wet.

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Good, please continue shooting yourselves in the foot, Christian institutions. The kids will remember this and they won't think poorly of their teachers for letting them know what pronouns they prefer.

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Thus far, I haven't been a big one for including pronouns in my email or other correspondence, though now that I think about it, my given name can be gender-ambiguous and there have been a couple incidents where I have been mis-identified. [shrug] That said, Houghton University is clearly looking to vie for the Hammer-Ass of the Year award for choosing to fire Ms. Zelaya on the basis of her including such notation as a part of her comms (and while we're at it, it doesn't get a whole lot more blatant than that letter, does it?).

So what we have here is yet another example of a Christian organization choosing to be LESS inclusive, LESS accepting, and ultimately, LESS CHRISTIAN. Ummm ... irony much?

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I would say they're being MORE christian.

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Depends on the model you want to use. Whether it's the "Love-your-enemies" paradigm or the "I-come-not-to-bring-peace-but-a-sword" line that the radicals seem to like lately. To be fair, not all Christians act like the administration at Houghton University, but the ones getting the most attention lately are those who are working the hardest at being assholes.

OT - Just tried to edit this to correct one word and the comment disappeared rather than saved. More bugs, people.

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It's a feature.

(โ ๏ฝกโ โ€ขฬ€โ แด—โ -โ )

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Yes and no, edit your comment as usual, save it and refresh your page.

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