It is WAY past time that the secular / nonbeliever community got the recognition that WE HAVE EARNED with our growing numbers. This is good news. Let's hear more of it!
Interesting. Only in the US would this actually be necessary at least in most of the developed world. Because in most of the developed world the religious vote as such is minuscule. We have one functional – very loud – openly religious party, and they haven't managed to achieve anything – yet. And I suspect will never. One of them is contesting an electorate seat in a by-election soon, I'll let you know what happens. :)
Edit:: Just popped across to a blog site where they were discussing a new Christian party, a right wing website. Even there the comments are something like I'd never vote for a Christian party.
The government is centre-right and does run boot camps for at risk young people. It's basically just red meat for their base. Very few people believe they actually work. Other than that I don't think so. We do have a number of very secretive religious sects, one of which has been in the news lately for sexual abuse, but as far as I know no actual boot camps.
We really need to work more on normalizing the term "atheist". I'm certain a lot of that 48% are technically atheists, but don't use that label because of the stigma and/or misinformation attached to it. We need to stop allowing the religious to define it for us and perpetuate those myths. The more public and unabashed atheists there are, the faster we can secularize government.
Amen. The word has all sorts of negative history to it, which is also why I prefer to use it.
A wise man once asked me where I stood, and at the time I said agnostic (I was very young). He said, “Well that’s just a chicken shit atheist” 🤣 Thus, I’m now an atheist and have been for a long time.
I can’t know for a fact that there are no superhero-type gods like Zeus, Thor, Quetzlcoatl, Brahma, or Anubis. Unlikely, sure, and I absolutely don’t believe they exist, but can I know for certain? Nope.
But with respect to the monotheists’ beloved “omni” deities — who are claimed to be omnipotent, omnipresent, omniscient, and omnibenevolent — I can be 100% a gnostic atheist, because such a critter cannot logically exist. Why not? Because any entity can have at most a single ultimate characteristic, not a combination of them. Whenever it’s claimed that there are two or more maxipowers, you can always find a way to put them in conflict with each other, at which point one of them must lose.
For example, if God knows everything that’s ever going to happen (which an omniscient being would), then he’s powerless to change anything (and omnipotence is right out the window). And vice versa. Is he everywhere, including places where unspeakable tortures are being committed (frequently in his name), but also all-loving? Please!
But even a single ultimate characteristic could be pitted against itself, as in “Can God make a rock so heavy he can’t lift it?”. Whatever the answer might be, it puts the lie to being all-powerful.
I have identified as atheist since I first came out over 10 years ago. I prefer the term because it is the most unambiguous term for someone who does not believe in any form of god.
Joemygod has a post today about the Kennedy Centre hosting a come-to-jesus film which it claims “showcases the remarkable resurgence of faith among the youth of America,” I visited my fundy relative's church plant last week. It's on a very run-down, rough inner city estate in the north of England. Five US-ians came over for a week of mission. I attended the final BBQ. The arrogant Pennsylvanian pastor told me confidently that, though churches have mostly lost Millenials and Gen Z, this present, Gen A will start the coming revival. He waved his hand at the local kids who snuck in and were snaffling, snatching as much food as they could cos they know the church folk don't mind but see their attendance as opportunities to tell them to come to jesus. I nearly ROTFL - he claimed they were the future church leaders. In reality, most will soon, if not already, be involved in petty crime, vandalism and drugs. An 8yo was shot in the leg not long ago, opposite the church, rare for guns to be involved here in the UK. I'm guessing this pastor will be sending messages to his home church about the fantastic number of kids who came to the kids club, (about 20, mostly members' kids), heard the gospel and, hallelujah, got saved. (none did.) His claims will doubtless be as delusional and false as those regular proclamations that his orange king makes about his 'successes' in everything he touches!
I was on Cranach yesterday,(It's the only blog on Patheos that allows any form of discussion really.) where they had a piece on a religious revival in Britain. 10 seconds of googling and I found an article by a statistician debunking it.
Cranach is a Missouri Synod Lutheran blog. My father was a MS Lutheran minister. I used to hang out at Cranach just to be reminded of Dad. So many of the commenters were assholes in exactly the same way I remember Dad bitching about his fellow LCMS ministers (he called them “blackshirts”) and his more obnoxious congregants. The ones who thought they knew the Bible better than someone who went to seminary and could read Ancient Greek and Hebrew with some translation texts.
Dad would have been 102 this year. I thought what he believed was bollocks but he was sincere and loving and not an asshole and I wish I could still talk with him.
One of the blogs on Patheos put up a subscription fee to even be able to see most of his posts. Occasionally there would be a free one. I can't remember if that's the one. I remember visiting it, but I haven't for some time.
I've been on The Latin Rite quit a bit. There can be some decent discussions, but there's been a fair amount of infighting lately. A few tolerable people, a couple absolute morons, leans fairly strongly MAGA. I actually did a guest post there a while back, working on another.
Yeah, you see, the "A" that looks like the English letter "A" is actually the Greek letter alpha (symbol: A), because they ran out of English letters after Gen Z. (How do I know this? Because my wife keeps telling ME "please try to keep up".)
His wife and 2 teenage kids came along plus their worship leader. It occurred to me to wonder if they'd had any sort of background check. Here in the Uk, we're much stricter about that. Even teen kids are vetted before working with children. But possibly the pastor of the church here would assume checks had been done for their own US church. It's kind of a totally subconscious mindset here, no church worker would ever try to be alone with a child - if, for example one was ill during a session, and needed to be driven home, a 2nd adult would accompany the driver. There are no private rooms or offices on the premises, but, as you say, and because I read atheist blogs, I'm more aware than many UK x-tians of the epidemic of pedophilia among clergy of all denominations.
Christian Post has run a string of articles lately about the big impending revival amongst the youth. Especially young men. The commenters mostly don’t seem to be buying it.
There seems to be a lot of hype for this so-called revival, but I don’t buy it. I see conservative commentators playing it up as if it were fact. Also, winning over young men only (for now) is a pretty lame accomplishment.
I think the young male thing, which seems to have some data behind it, is an artifact of men falling behind women in lots of traditional measures of accomplishment. Going to college. Graduating from college. A larger and larger fraction of men don’t seem to be cutting it in the adulting way — and so they gravitate to traditional authoritarian cultures.
Yes. Our patriarchal society absolutely hurts men too. Strict gender roles are limiting and men are taught from a young age they can’t have emotions. I don’t think going to church will solve this at all, but reinforce dated beliefs of God-given superiority. These young men who are falling behind are not told to put in the work to catch up or compete. They are being offered a way out via the church. It’s like trad-wife propaganda telling women that really cooking and cleaning under the control of a spouse is fun and submission is admirable.
Just wait until Mary-like young women in the south can no longer get cancer screenings, see a GYN, and their friends die from sepsis. They still might not connect the dots, but the light will look funny if they look at it right. Oh, and when women can’t vote. Guess it will be too late then to have a change of heart…
How easily we forget how the past really was, to see only the rosy fictional vision. I'm only one generation away from the first Measles vaccine. My great-grandmother* was between 34 and 44 when she could vote for the first time. She would have fought teeth and claws to keep this right.
* I don't know her birth year, just that she was in her 80's when she passed away in 1994.
I don’t announce to people that I am an atheist, unless I am asked. I keep that aspect of myself (unlike the religious, my atheism is only one small part of who I am) to my self.
The religious on the other hand seem to have the need to tell everyone about themselves and the religion that they (religious) are part of.
I have also seen that the religious consider their religion not just part of who they are, but their (religious) whole identity. So to question; criticize; or even mock their religion; according to the religious is on the same level as a physical assault, and the religious response is often violent (because the non religious are attacking not only their religion, but the religious themselves).
That is the mindset that some of the religious have, and what we (nonbelievers) must deal with.
Some Christians actually believe that atheists do that! Others think that atheists are incapable of loving anyone, beings nice and doing good, etc.
Try talking to us to find out how atheists think, instead of being told what atheists are by extreme right wing clergy or extreme right wing media. Or people could judge us (atheists) by our actions, just like atheists will judge Christians by their actions (or lack of actions).
Yeah, told the story before but – friend of mine was teaching physics and a high school and they were talking about something I forget what, one of the kids said "Ah but he is an atheist." And this fundamentalist girl came up to him afterwards and said "But, but – you're nice!"
OT: 3 official days until retirement. My manager told me today to check my email and voice mail a couple of times a day but otherwise I don’t even have to pretend I’m doing anything.
"Gerrymander effectively silences the voice of minority groups. However as it also effectively silences the majority as well, it complies with the fourteenth amendment, as all are equally worthless in the eyes of the law. And since, because of gerrymandering, the election is essentially pre-determined, we find it within the discretionary power of the executive branch to save the country's time and money by declaring the winners of the elections.". Judge Robert probably 2026
It is WAY past time that the secular / nonbeliever community got the recognition that WE HAVE EARNED with our growing numbers. This is good news. Let's hear more of it!
They (and you) can always move here.
That would require mucho de-euro.
There is megachurches for that.
Thanks ... though I don't speak French worth a damn.
Ça s'apprend ;)
True enough, but Cleveland has been home for me for a very long time. I wonder how much it would take for France and me to be anywhere near the same.
Non.
TS is younger than you.
Try again, you whippersnapper.
I'm sad that it is only 48%.
I'm sure some don't realize they really don't believe the superstition anymore but may not identify themselves as such, yet.
There was a time (most of history, actually) when it was way down in the low single digits, so we've come about halfway to where we SHOULD be.
Interesting. Only in the US would this actually be necessary at least in most of the developed world. Because in most of the developed world the religious vote as such is minuscule. We have one functional – very loud – openly religious party, and they haven't managed to achieve anything – yet. And I suspect will never. One of them is contesting an electorate seat in a by-election soon, I'll let you know what happens. :)
Edit:: Just popped across to a blog site where they were discussing a new Christian party, a right wing website. Even there the comments are something like I'd never vote for a Christian party.
Are there many war-like religious boot camps in New Zealand? 😭
The government is centre-right and does run boot camps for at risk young people. It's basically just red meat for their base. Very few people believe they actually work. Other than that I don't think so. We do have a number of very secretive religious sects, one of which has been in the news lately for sexual abuse, but as far as I know no actual boot camps.
Be glad, they are trying to take us back to the dark ages.
We really need to work more on normalizing the term "atheist". I'm certain a lot of that 48% are technically atheists, but don't use that label because of the stigma and/or misinformation attached to it. We need to stop allowing the religious to define it for us and perpetuate those myths. The more public and unabashed atheists there are, the faster we can secularize government.
Amen. The word has all sorts of negative history to it, which is also why I prefer to use it.
A wise man once asked me where I stood, and at the time I said agnostic (I was very young). He said, “Well that’s just a chicken shit atheist” 🤣 Thus, I’m now an atheist and have been for a long time.
Yes the dipshits that claim atheism "is a religion" amuse me, it literally means no deity!
They can't see further than their noses.
I can’t know for a fact that there are no superhero-type gods like Zeus, Thor, Quetzlcoatl, Brahma, or Anubis. Unlikely, sure, and I absolutely don’t believe they exist, but can I know for certain? Nope.
But with respect to the monotheists’ beloved “omni” deities — who are claimed to be omnipotent, omnipresent, omniscient, and omnibenevolent — I can be 100% a gnostic atheist, because such a critter cannot logically exist. Why not? Because any entity can have at most a single ultimate characteristic, not a combination of them. Whenever it’s claimed that there are two or more maxipowers, you can always find a way to put them in conflict with each other, at which point one of them must lose.
For example, if God knows everything that’s ever going to happen (which an omniscient being would), then he’s powerless to change anything (and omnipotence is right out the window). And vice versa. Is he everywhere, including places where unspeakable tortures are being committed (frequently in his name), but also all-loving? Please!
But even a single ultimate characteristic could be pitted against itself, as in “Can God make a rock so heavy he can’t lift it?”. Whatever the answer might be, it puts the lie to being all-powerful.
I prefer non-theist
Actually, I am more of an apatheist -- I just do not give a damn!
I have identified as atheist since I first came out over 10 years ago. I prefer the term because it is the most unambiguous term for someone who does not believe in any form of god.
Could some kind poster tell me if this is a day ending in y?
https://ibb.co/rffv96cn
And as we also always point out: "Not a drag queen."
And likely someone who accuses LGBT people of being groomers.
With guys like this, Accusation = Confession.
https://ibb.co/8nCVTCnQ
Sweet FUCK! These assholes just don't know when to quit. 😖
We have 14-year-olds being charged as adults, so WTF is he talking about?
https://thedevilspanties.com/archives/16724
Mouseover or tap to see more text. Scroll down a little more for another of her comments.
Her boss has 34 felony convictions.
And was found liable for sexual assault, I might add.
The only crimes he sees are the crimes he and his cabinet and staff are committing.
Absolutely, their obsession with it is a red flag.
FAKE NEWS!!! Deep state!
It's the derp state.
What day is it?
Mardi, presque mercredi.
Alas, my financial situation makes giving to worthy causes well-nigh impossible, no matter how fervently I believe in those causes.
Trump is known to exaggerate the size of his pen.....
.
.
t house.
The irony is that he's a big dick.
Joemygod has a post today about the Kennedy Centre hosting a come-to-jesus film which it claims “showcases the remarkable resurgence of faith among the youth of America,” I visited my fundy relative's church plant last week. It's on a very run-down, rough inner city estate in the north of England. Five US-ians came over for a week of mission. I attended the final BBQ. The arrogant Pennsylvanian pastor told me confidently that, though churches have mostly lost Millenials and Gen Z, this present, Gen A will start the coming revival. He waved his hand at the local kids who snuck in and were snaffling, snatching as much food as they could cos they know the church folk don't mind but see their attendance as opportunities to tell them to come to jesus. I nearly ROTFL - he claimed they were the future church leaders. In reality, most will soon, if not already, be involved in petty crime, vandalism and drugs. An 8yo was shot in the leg not long ago, opposite the church, rare for guns to be involved here in the UK. I'm guessing this pastor will be sending messages to his home church about the fantastic number of kids who came to the kids club, (about 20, mostly members' kids), heard the gospel and, hallelujah, got saved. (none did.) His claims will doubtless be as delusional and false as those regular proclamations that his orange king makes about his 'successes' in everything he touches!
I was on Cranach yesterday,(It's the only blog on Patheos that allows any form of discussion really.) where they had a piece on a religious revival in Britain. 10 seconds of googling and I found an article by a statistician debunking it.
Cranach is a Missouri Synod Lutheran blog. My father was a MS Lutheran minister. I used to hang out at Cranach just to be reminded of Dad. So many of the commenters were assholes in exactly the same way I remember Dad bitching about his fellow LCMS ministers (he called them “blackshirts”) and his more obnoxious congregants. The ones who thought they knew the Bible better than someone who went to seminary and could read Ancient Greek and Hebrew with some translation texts.
Dad would have been 102 this year. I thought what he believed was bollocks but he was sincere and loving and not an asshole and I wish I could still talk with him.
Is that the premium account one?
?
One of the blogs on Patheos put up a subscription fee to even be able to see most of his posts. Occasionally there would be a free one. I can't remember if that's the one. I remember visiting it, but I haven't for some time.
I've been on The Latin Rite quit a bit. There can be some decent discussions, but there's been a fair amount of infighting lately. A few tolerable people, a couple absolute morons, leans fairly strongly MAGA. I actually did a guest post there a while back, working on another.
I can't keep up. What the hell is Gen A.
Your great, great, great, great children.
Gen Alpha, those born between 2010-2025.
Yeah, you see, the "A" that looks like the English letter "A" is actually the Greek letter alpha (symbol: A), because they ran out of English letters after Gen Z. (How do I know this? Because my wife keeps telling ME "please try to keep up".)
I am probably younger than you and can't keep up either 🤣
Wonder if any of his recent successful touches involved kids.
His wife and 2 teenage kids came along plus their worship leader. It occurred to me to wonder if they'd had any sort of background check. Here in the Uk, we're much stricter about that. Even teen kids are vetted before working with children. But possibly the pastor of the church here would assume checks had been done for their own US church. It's kind of a totally subconscious mindset here, no church worker would ever try to be alone with a child - if, for example one was ill during a session, and needed to be driven home, a 2nd adult would accompany the driver. There are no private rooms or offices on the premises, but, as you say, and because I read atheist blogs, I'm more aware than many UK x-tians of the epidemic of pedophilia among clergy of all denominations.
Christian Post has run a string of articles lately about the big impending revival amongst the youth. Especially young men. The commenters mostly don’t seem to be buying it.
Here’s today’s:
https://www.christianpost.com/news/eric-metaxas-exhorts-pastors-to-be-bold-amid-revival.html
There seems to be a lot of hype for this so-called revival, but I don’t buy it. I see conservative commentators playing it up as if it were fact. Also, winning over young men only (for now) is a pretty lame accomplishment.
I think the young male thing, which seems to have some data behind it, is an artifact of men falling behind women in lots of traditional measures of accomplishment. Going to college. Graduating from college. A larger and larger fraction of men don’t seem to be cutting it in the adulting way — and so they gravitate to traditional authoritarian cultures.
Yes. Our patriarchal society absolutely hurts men too. Strict gender roles are limiting and men are taught from a young age they can’t have emotions. I don’t think going to church will solve this at all, but reinforce dated beliefs of God-given superiority. These young men who are falling behind are not told to put in the work to catch up or compete. They are being offered a way out via the church. It’s like trad-wife propaganda telling women that really cooking and cleaning under the control of a spouse is fun and submission is admirable.
Just wait until Mary-like young women in the south can no longer get cancer screenings, see a GYN, and their friends die from sepsis. They still might not connect the dots, but the light will look funny if they look at it right. Oh, and when women can’t vote. Guess it will be too late then to have a change of heart…
How easily we forget how the past really was, to see only the rosy fictional vision. I'm only one generation away from the first Measles vaccine. My great-grandmother* was between 34 and 44 when she could vote for the first time. She would have fought teeth and claws to keep this right.
* I don't know her birth year, just that she was in her 80's when she passed away in 1994.
So true!
This is why the Xtian White nationalists/christofascists are so frantic to expand indoctrination into all aspects of our lives.
OT - Houston, please explain
Amazon's description of Van Camp's Pork and Beans lists it as being vegan. 🤔
Well there's just one little piece of pork that can be easily scooped out. Then it's vegan. 🙄
If you're lucky, there is that 𝑜𝑛𝑒 little piece of pork fat.
The can is shown a picture of pork fat.
You believe advertising?
Muahahahahahahaha
Tofu pork.
Make that seitan, tempeh or jackfruit. Tofu is versatile but doesn't have the right texture.
Tinie Tempah?
Well, vegans do love bacon.................................
Not this one. Racler des peaux de bananes est chiant.
I have several friends who are vegans. One of them I always ask when they come over to eat “Do you want bacon with that?”
I would point you toward the nearest supermarket to get your own bacon.
I don’t announce to people that I am an atheist, unless I am asked. I keep that aspect of myself (unlike the religious, my atheism is only one small part of who I am) to my self.
The religious on the other hand seem to have the need to tell everyone about themselves and the religion that they (religious) are part of.
I have also seen that the religious consider their religion not just part of who they are, but their (religious) whole identity. So to question; criticize; or even mock their religion; according to the religious is on the same level as a physical assault, and the religious response is often violent (because the non religious are attacking not only their religion, but the religious themselves).
That is the mindset that some of the religious have, and what we (nonbelievers) must deal with.
https://ibb.co/whxgP7v9
So true!
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/f651540fa0e9ffdc048b4518c7ccc640f087fd5a744506efc5fc08363e3b7d6c.jpg
Some Christians actually believe that atheists do that! Others think that atheists are incapable of loving anyone, beings nice and doing good, etc.
Try talking to us to find out how atheists think, instead of being told what atheists are by extreme right wing clergy or extreme right wing media. Or people could judge us (atheists) by our actions, just like atheists will judge Christians by their actions (or lack of actions).
Yeah, told the story before but – friend of mine was teaching physics and a high school and they were talking about something I forget what, one of the kids said "Ah but he is an atheist." And this fundamentalist girl came up to him afterwards and said "But, but – you're nice!"
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/fbcfc6d652dbcbe399a62abccb86860f76e148071d4ba23460e90435d5f9c4fe.jpg
OT - More astronomy
𝐀𝐧 𝐢𝐧𝐜𝐫𝐞𝐝𝐢𝐛𝐥𝐞 𝐉𝐖𝐒𝐓 𝐢𝐦𝐚𝐠𝐞 𝐨𝐟 𝐚𝐧 𝐢𝐦𝐦𝐞𝐧𝐬𝐞 𝐜𝐢𝐭𝐲 𝐨𝐟 𝐠𝐚𝐥𝐚𝐱𝐢𝐞𝐬
https://badastronomy.beehiiv.com/p/an-incredible-jwst-image-of-an-immense-city-of-galaxies-268f6abd24e75d16
Astropolis? Cosmopolis?
Coruscant.
Thankfully not Mega-City One.
OT: 3 official days until retirement. My manager told me today to check my email and voice mail a couple of times a day but otherwise I don’t even have to pretend I’m doing anything.
And if you do, he will use that as an excuse to fire you.
So much winning!
Link: https://www.thedailybeast.com/elon-muskss-grok-chatbot-crowns-donald-trump-the-most-notorious-criminal-in-dc/
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/9VvddhhRrxE
Well, duh! Neither she nor the G卐P believes in that part.
"Gerrymander effectively silences the voice of minority groups. However as it also effectively silences the majority as well, it complies with the fourteenth amendment, as all are equally worthless in the eyes of the law. And since, because of gerrymandering, the election is essentially pre-determined, we find it within the discretionary power of the executive branch to save the country's time and money by declaring the winners of the elections.". Judge Robert probably 2026
Gerry Manders was great as the Beaver.