Jesus would wonder why you religious hypocrites are wasting money on this while your governor tries to murder immigrants and hungry people go to bed without food every night.
Amen! Jesus talked about the hypocrites of his day who neglected justice, mercy and faithfulness while appearing outwardly religious. In some ways, times haven't changed that much.
If that's the case, you should have no problem with the Texas Jewish community placing a menorah and maybe a dreidel right next to your nativity scene, and TST's Baphomet can go on the other side. Oh, but of course, Middleton's idea of freedom of religion only extends to HIS religion, and everyone else can go fish.
I fully expect the Freedom From Religion Foundation and American Atheists to be all over this issue like white on rice ... because Texas apparently needs to learn this lesson AGAIN.
"Undeniable fact," eh? Okay. Quantify the "soul." Exactly what is it, and how does it show itself, USING HARD EVIDENCE. Hand-waving and references to the bible [edit: OR THE QURAN!!!] will not cut it here. Either show your work or go home.
Oh, and be advised: there is a far better than average chance that you won't be here that long, anyway, so make it quick, eh?
Religion of peace, yeah sure. If a Muslim decides that Islam is not for them and leaves, that person is an apostate so they can be killed. Or how about fatwa against Rushdie because he wrote a damm book that may or may not mock the prophet. Or declaring a jihad against cartoonists who drew the prophet. I respect your right to worship any god or goddess you want, but I am not under any obligation to respect or follow your religious beliefs. As for the creator prove it, all religions claim their religion is an undeniable fact. Prove the soul exists.
Peter in his first letter wrote "Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect." How is "fat reddit atheist" in keeping with that?
Of course Texas. Pissing on the Constitution is what they do. The "if you don't like it, don't look" bullshit only applies to private property. If you don't want to see a nativity scene at a church, don't go to that church. If you don't want to see a nativity scene at the state Capitol, don't put it up.
The politico should pay for a booth posting a warning that a nativity scene is 200 feet away and give out white canes for those who do not want to see it. Might be a good protest for folks against Theocracy to don sunglasses and hover about the nativity scene waking it with white canes all the time in tune with Jingle-bells.
If our country was founded on “Judeo-Christian” beliefs, then show me where those beliefs are in our constitution and laws. Show me where Moses is mentioned, the Ten Commandments are codified, where is god and Jesus in our actual governing documents. The Declaration of Independence is not a legal document nor does it talk about god and Jesus or the Ten Commandments. In fact, it is a direct attack on biblical principles, specifically the divine right of kings.
Every amendment in the bill of rights is at odds with the majority of the Ten Commandments, and the overall lesson of the Bible, our country was founded on individual freedom, the Bible is based on obedience to higher authority.
Of course, Middleton is chummy with The Liar Barton. Aside from the fact that Barton has no credentials to be a historian, he’s been shown to be a fraud and untrustworthy even by the Christian nationalists. One of his books was pulled by a Christian publisher, with his same agenda, for being unsupported and false.
Christmas trees are one thing. A nativity scene on state property is entirely another, particularly when the state says that the scene will be the ONLY display present.
Agree, I was just trying to point out the fallacy of the bill supporters trying to use the tree as an example of Christian Christmas icons already in the capital.
Quite a few religions use trees as a symbol. Why should one religion get top billing and no others? Btw, few religions are religions of peace. Look at all the horror done in their name. Maybe the Quakers actually reflect that peace.
This type of Christian does not believe in anyone's freedom of religion other than their own. Not even that of many other Christian tribes. Because they see themselves in possession of divine truth, they convince themselves they have the right to rule as they see fit, and never stop trying to mark their territory in the public square owned by all citizens. Our secular government cannot choose one religion over another. This is settled law going back to the eighteenth century. It is as if they cannot celebrate their religious holiday unless they get to force their myth on everyone else.
The same state that calls itself pro-life has the highest death penalty rate in the entire country. As of September 2024, the Lone Brain Cell State has carried out 589 executions, 4 times the next-highest state (Oklahoma with 125, followed by Virginia's 113, Florida's 106 and Missouri's 99. All bible belt states).
Pro-life? They might want to come up with a new name.
One of the great things about atheism is that we get to celebrate everybody’s holidays without ever having to worry about being accused of blasphemy, heresy, apostasy, or (worst of all) evangelism.
The concept of the separation of church and state goes back as far as the Virginia Declaration of Rights, Section 16, which was adopted in 1776. While it's true that the phrase 'wall of separation' was used by Jefferson in his letter to the Danbury Baptists, it was merely shorthand for the constitutionally protected rights against establishment of state religion and intrusion on individuals' free exercise.
By pushing other religious expressions out of the state house and grounds, Texas is violating the Supreme Court's finding in Cantwell v CT: "Free Exercise Clause categorically prohibits government from regulating, prohibiting, or rewarding religious beliefs as such."
I hope FFRF, the ACLU, and Americans United, among others, sue Texas into bankruptcy for clearly attempting to establish christianity as their state religion.
You are confused about what we are saying here. Your comments are supporting our stances. No one here is saying the constitution has the exact words, “wall of separation of church and state”. In fact, Jane specifically said what you repeated in your second paragraph, the phrase was used in the letter to the Danbury Baptists, and the original article also says the same. You are trying to argue with a strawman, and losing.
Thanks, Val. Jefferson wrote that famous letter responding to an inquiry from the Baptist congregation of Danbury, CT in 1802, while he was president. He used the shorthand 'wall of separation' between religion and government to describe what the Establishment and Free Exercise Clauses of the First Amendment were intended to accomplish. Jefferson was well-versed on the colonial fight for disestablishment, having supported George Mason's Virginia Declaration of Rights in 1776, and himself writing the Virginia Statute for Religious Freedom, which was shepherded through the Virginia legislature by his friend and protege James Madison, who himself went on to author not only the Constitution of the United States but also Bill of Rights.
It's hilarious that "Religion of Peace" uses ChatGPT but can't be bothered to use spellcheck or Gramerly or something to make his points more coherent.
Put up rainbow flags throughout the Texas Capitol during June Pride Month. Yeah, I'm sure Middleton would adapt the "you don't have to look at it" posture for that.
Texas the way I see it more people have been hurt by Christianity than helped by it. Fuck you and what you want. I would want all faiths to have some kind of representation of what the Winter Solstice means to them up in your State Capitol. Why? Because the Texas Governor and Texas politicians represent all the people of Texas not just the Christians. Got it Texas?
I can pretty well guarantee you that NO ONE HERE thinks that religion MUST be kept out of public life. The fact is (and this is borne out with the Galloway decision) that if ONE religion can be represented in a public space, then ALL RELIGIONS HAVE THAT SAME RIGHT.
As it comes to Texas, they are NOT following the Galloway example because they are permitting ONLY A CHRISTIAN DISPLAY, while saying, "If you don't like it, you don't have to look." This is clearly unconstitutional, in that it demonstrates a governmental preference and favoritism for ONE RELIGION over another.
BTW, your cutting-and-pasting is showing, probably because you have about as good a grasp of English syntax as I have of either Arabic or Farsi ... so how about you spare us the BS and just LEAVE, eh?
Who asked it about its religious preference? I mean, troublesh00ter didn’t bring it up or assume anything, but it accused him of lying about its religion.
I DID read carefully (not "careful" - learn English syntax, would you?) and the bill specifies a Christian nativity scene, without ANY consideration for any other religious display. Like it or not, THAT AMOUNTS TO PREFERENCE, and THAT IS UNCONSTITUTIONAL. Whether it amounts to a overt endorsement may be debatable, but the Freedom From Religion Foundation has fought against many such displays in the past, and in the vast majority of cases, THEY HAVE WON.
Texas frankly is being stupid here, never mind the strong likelihood of wasting taxpayer monies, both with the display and with the inevitable lawsuits (which they will, in all probability, LOSE).
I know American law, bub. As a member of FFRF myself, I've run onto crap like this more often than you can hope to imagine. What's your excuse?
Christians 364 days of the year: "Lying is bad. Being weird, like those homosekshuals, bisekshuals, transgendered degenerates, atheists, Satanists, Muslims all are, is also bad."
Christians tomorrow: "Let's celebrate the birth of a person whose mother was a virgin when she got pregnant!"
"the state finally sent FFRF a check for the legal fees and penalties amounting to $358,073.67. It could have been avoided if Abbott just accepted the principle of religious freedom and plurality."
Abbott didn't care. It wasn't HIS wallet that ended up 350 grand lighter, it was the Texas state treasury. And these bozos will keep on doing this kind of shit as long as they see nothing but upside in it, never any downside.
Christmas trees, Middleton? Those are pagan symbols.
Care to discus how the Christians at the Massachusetts Bay Colony fought a 22-year War on Christmas? They despised its pagan roots. So much so they enacted the "Penalty for Keeping Christmas" law in 1659, making it officially illegal to celebrate Christmas by feasting, not working, etc. They even arrested and levied a fine of 5 shillings (about $48 dollars now) for those who dared to celebrate. They finally repealed that law in 1681, but even after that Christmas remained unpopular throughout New England (it was seen as a "Popish" holiday celbrated by Catholics, Episcopalians, Lutherans and Methodists. Others like Congregationalists, Baptists, Presbyterians, etc. continued to shun it right into the 19th Century).
These were Christians persecuting other Christians, Middleton.
Jesus would wonder why you religious hypocrites are wasting money on this while your governor tries to murder immigrants and hungry people go to bed without food every night.
And why the electrical grid shuts down every time there's a storm or freezing weather.
Thoughts and prayers for electricity.
Taking care of those in need isn't nearly as much fun as inflicting pain on the powerless and forcing their religion on others.
"The Cruelty Is the Point."
Amen! Jesus talked about the hypocrites of his day who neglected justice, mercy and faithfulness while appearing outwardly religious. In some ways, times haven't changed that much.
𝑅𝑒𝑙𝑖𝑔𝑖𝑜𝑢𝑠 𝑙𝑖𝑏𝑒𝑟𝑡𝑖𝑒𝑠 𝑎𝑛𝑑 𝑓𝑟𝑒𝑒𝑑𝑜𝑚 𝑜𝑓 𝑒𝑥𝑝𝑟𝑒𝑠𝑠𝑖𝑜𝑛 𝑜𝑓 𝑜𝑢𝑟 𝑓𝑎𝑖𝑡ℎ, 𝐹𝑟𝑒𝑒 𝐸𝑥𝑒𝑟𝑐𝑖𝑠𝑒 𝐶𝑎𝑢𝑠𝑒, 𝑎𝑟𝑒 𝑣𝑒𝑟𝑦 𝑖𝑚𝑝𝑜𝑟𝑡𝑎𝑛𝑡 𝑖𝑛 𝑜𝑢𝑟 𝑆𝑡𝑎𝑡𝑒 𝐿𝑒𝑔𝑖𝑠𝑙𝑎𝑡𝑢𝑟𝑒...
If that's the case, you should have no problem with the Texas Jewish community placing a menorah and maybe a dreidel right next to your nativity scene, and TST's Baphomet can go on the other side. Oh, but of course, Middleton's idea of freedom of religion only extends to HIS religion, and everyone else can go fish.
I fully expect the Freedom From Religion Foundation and American Atheists to be all over this issue like white on rice ... because Texas apparently needs to learn this lesson AGAIN.
The instructional litigation needs to be continuous. Their ability to retain the info resembles goldfish memory.
But they won't. When these things get shot down, it just gives them something to scream Persecution! about.
The only way they will learn this lesson is when it is applied with a 2x4 upside their deeply stupid skulls.
"Undeniable fact," eh? Okay. Quantify the "soul." Exactly what is it, and how does it show itself, USING HARD EVIDENCE. Hand-waving and references to the bible [edit: OR THE QURAN!!!] will not cut it here. Either show your work or go home.
Oh, and be advised: there is a far better than average chance that you won't be here that long, anyway, so make it quick, eh?
Your soul is poetry in motion. https://youtu.be/Oy_ArpznZUs?si=-s1GqDvvOnFzVoNe
Religion of peace, yeah sure. If a Muslim decides that Islam is not for them and leaves, that person is an apostate so they can be killed. Or how about fatwa against Rushdie because he wrote a damm book that may or may not mock the prophet. Or declaring a jihad against cartoonists who drew the prophet. I respect your right to worship any god or goddess you want, but I am not under any obligation to respect or follow your religious beliefs. As for the creator prove it, all religions claim their religion is an undeniable fact. Prove the soul exists.
A joke my 80 year old mother told me some years ago:
Have you heard that Salman Rushdie has written a new book? It's called:
"Buddah is a Fucking Asshole!"
The Pastafarians welcome you. Consume the spaghetti and rest in the oblivion of a carb overload.
We’re not on Reddit, so who’s the one with the flawed brain? Yeah, that would be you. 🙄
Reddit and weap.
I don't have the right dressing for this word salad. Try again.
Mostly because none exists. 😝
Peter in his first letter wrote "Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect." How is "fat reddit atheist" in keeping with that?
Troll is apparently a Muslim. I'm not sure if a similar passage is to be found in the Koran.
There are Karenists in every religion.
Brilliant!
Of course Texas. Pissing on the Constitution is what they do. The "if you don't like it, don't look" bullshit only applies to private property. If you don't want to see a nativity scene at a church, don't go to that church. If you don't want to see a nativity scene at the state Capitol, don't put it up.
The Evangelicals think that the government is private property: theirs.
"if you don't like it, don't look" sounds more like a child’s reaction
The politico should pay for a booth posting a warning that a nativity scene is 200 feet away and give out white canes for those who do not want to see it. Might be a good protest for folks against Theocracy to don sunglasses and hover about the nativity scene waking it with white canes all the time in tune with Jingle-bells.
lol!!
If our country was founded on “Judeo-Christian” beliefs, then show me where those beliefs are in our constitution and laws. Show me where Moses is mentioned, the Ten Commandments are codified, where is god and Jesus in our actual governing documents. The Declaration of Independence is not a legal document nor does it talk about god and Jesus or the Ten Commandments. In fact, it is a direct attack on biblical principles, specifically the divine right of kings.
Every amendment in the bill of rights is at odds with the majority of the Ten Commandments, and the overall lesson of the Bible, our country was founded on individual freedom, the Bible is based on obedience to higher authority.
Of course, Middleton is chummy with The Liar Barton. Aside from the fact that Barton has no credentials to be a historian, he’s been shown to be a fraud and untrustworthy even by the Christian nationalists. One of his books was pulled by a Christian publisher, with his same agenda, for being unsupported and false.
Preach it!
A lit up tree is a pagan symbol, pure and simple.
Christmas trees are one thing. A nativity scene on state property is entirely another, particularly when the state says that the scene will be the ONLY display present.
That tree is definitely going to be lit. Once it is dry enough.
Agree, I was just trying to point out the fallacy of the bill supporters trying to use the tree as an example of Christian Christmas icons already in the capital.
Quite a few religions use trees as a symbol. Why should one religion get top billing and no others? Btw, few religions are religions of peace. Look at all the horror done in their name. Maybe the Quakers actually reflect that peace.
Quakers had their prisons.
Yep!
https://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/Jeremiah-Chapter-10/
And Yule like. No Yule love it!
This type of Christian does not believe in anyone's freedom of religion other than their own. Not even that of many other Christian tribes. Because they see themselves in possession of divine truth, they convince themselves they have the right to rule as they see fit, and never stop trying to mark their territory in the public square owned by all citizens. Our secular government cannot choose one religion over another. This is settled law going back to the eighteenth century. It is as if they cannot celebrate their religious holiday unless they get to force their myth on everyone else.
💯💯💯
The same state that calls itself pro-life has the highest death penalty rate in the entire country. As of September 2024, the Lone Brain Cell State has carried out 589 executions, 4 times the next-highest state (Oklahoma with 125, followed by Virginia's 113, Florida's 106 and Missouri's 99. All bible belt states).
Pro-life? They might want to come up with a new name.
Hypocrisy is their foundation.
Happy _________! (Insert winter solstice festival of your choice!)
Back atcha! Whatever you do or celebrate, enjoy and BE SAFE!
My Xmas tree has a Flying Spaghetti Monster on the top, really, it does.
Bah humbug to them all. : )
One of the great things about atheism is that we get to celebrate everybody’s holidays without ever having to worry about being accused of blasphemy, heresy, apostasy, or (worst of all) evangelism.
And we don’t have to pretend to care if we don’t want to celebrate someone’s holiday.
The concept of the separation of church and state goes back as far as the Virginia Declaration of Rights, Section 16, which was adopted in 1776. While it's true that the phrase 'wall of separation' was used by Jefferson in his letter to the Danbury Baptists, it was merely shorthand for the constitutionally protected rights against establishment of state religion and intrusion on individuals' free exercise.
By pushing other religious expressions out of the state house and grounds, Texas is violating the Supreme Court's finding in Cantwell v CT: "Free Exercise Clause categorically prohibits government from regulating, prohibiting, or rewarding religious beliefs as such."
I hope FFRF, the ACLU, and Americans United, among others, sue Texas into bankruptcy for clearly attempting to establish christianity as their state religion.
You are confused about what we are saying here. Your comments are supporting our stances. No one here is saying the constitution has the exact words, “wall of separation of church and state”. In fact, Jane specifically said what you repeated in your second paragraph, the phrase was used in the letter to the Danbury Baptists, and the original article also says the same. You are trying to argue with a strawman, and losing.
Thanks, Val. Jefferson wrote that famous letter responding to an inquiry from the Baptist congregation of Danbury, CT in 1802, while he was president. He used the shorthand 'wall of separation' between religion and government to describe what the Establishment and Free Exercise Clauses of the First Amendment were intended to accomplish. Jefferson was well-versed on the colonial fight for disestablishment, having supported George Mason's Virginia Declaration of Rights in 1776, and himself writing the Virginia Statute for Religious Freedom, which was shepherded through the Virginia legislature by his friend and protege James Madison, who himself went on to author not only the Constitution of the United States but also Bill of Rights.
And pathetically a strawman without a brain.
You seem to have trouble with reading comprehension, hon.
And composition. : )
It's hilarious that "Religion of Peace" uses ChatGPT but can't be bothered to use spellcheck or Gramerly or something to make his points more coherent.
Also, what's a 'religon'?
A 666 sided polygon?
One of those villains from Star Trek?
One of the towers of the Nazgul?
An imaginary Platonic solid?
There’s plenty of case law that says otherwise, oh ignorant one.
Brilliant!
How about a comprise? They set up the display, and we can alter it. Just a little.
Turnabout is fair play.
https://i.pinimg.com/originals/de/ac/5d/deac5d3fc0ba8ba905969bfc351b285c.jpg
Seems right.
Put up rainbow flags throughout the Texas Capitol during June Pride Month. Yeah, I'm sure Middleton would adapt the "you don't have to look at it" posture for that.
Only question is: would he do that before or after he completely lost his shit? Details matter! 😁
Texas the way I see it more people have been hurt by Christianity than helped by it. Fuck you and what you want. I would want all faiths to have some kind of representation of what the Winter Solstice means to them up in your State Capitol. Why? Because the Texas Governor and Texas politicians represent all the people of Texas not just the Christians. Got it Texas?
Jeezyboy hates you and will give you a lump of coal. Then again, all I ever got was persecution, hatred and damnation.
Well Bagat I fking hate you too.
Oh, goodie, we have yet another troll on here, Mx. "Religion of Peace," whose grammar and sentence structure are almost as bad as their arguments.
I'll let Hemant know. Meantime, have fun, gang!
I wonder if Hemant can ban it while keeping the posts? They are at least good for a laugh.
They are pretty funny.
They’re funny because they say such stupid misinformed statements.
Yes, and in fractured English. And with an expectation of being taken seriously.
But maybe remove the (many) duplicate posts, to save time reading them 😒
I’m not reading them, just skimming to get the jist. Once I see its spam, I just scroll past.
Troll got a king-sized boot up the backside from Hemant.
I can pretty well guarantee you that NO ONE HERE thinks that religion MUST be kept out of public life. The fact is (and this is borne out with the Galloway decision) that if ONE religion can be represented in a public space, then ALL RELIGIONS HAVE THAT SAME RIGHT.
As it comes to Texas, they are NOT following the Galloway example because they are permitting ONLY A CHRISTIAN DISPLAY, while saying, "If you don't like it, you don't have to look." This is clearly unconstitutional, in that it demonstrates a governmental preference and favoritism for ONE RELIGION over another.
BTW, your cutting-and-pasting is showing, probably because you have about as good a grasp of English syntax as I have of either Arabic or Farsi ... so how about you spare us the BS and just LEAVE, eh?
It claims to choose Jesus, yet it embraces the claim of Islam ("The Religion of Peace').
It's not very good at this.
Who asked it about its religious preference? I mean, troublesh00ter didn’t bring it up or assume anything, but it accused him of lying about its religion.
Joe King said that he was apparently Muslim.
I don’t follow links from untrustworthy sources. Why don’t you explain it to me like you aren’t seven.
I DID read carefully (not "careful" - learn English syntax, would you?) and the bill specifies a Christian nativity scene, without ANY consideration for any other religious display. Like it or not, THAT AMOUNTS TO PREFERENCE, and THAT IS UNCONSTITUTIONAL. Whether it amounts to a overt endorsement may be debatable, but the Freedom From Religion Foundation has fought against many such displays in the past, and in the vast majority of cases, THEY HAVE WON.
Texas frankly is being stupid here, never mind the strong likelihood of wasting taxpayer monies, both with the display and with the inevitable lawsuits (which they will, in all probability, LOSE).
I know American law, bub. As a member of FFRF myself, I've run onto crap like this more often than you can hope to imagine. What's your excuse?
Being an atheist does not equate to being a Marxist. Conflate much?
(Slightly) OT:
Christians 364 days of the year: "Lying is bad. Being weird, like those homosekshuals, bisekshuals, transgendered degenerates, atheists, Satanists, Muslims all are, is also bad."
Christians tomorrow: "Let's celebrate the birth of a person whose mother was a virgin when she got pregnant!"
The OG big lie.
The world's longest-lasting hoax.
"the state finally sent FFRF a check for the legal fees and penalties amounting to $358,073.67. It could have been avoided if Abbott just accepted the principle of religious freedom and plurality."
Abbott didn't care. It wasn't HIS wallet that ended up 350 grand lighter, it was the Texas state treasury. And these bozos will keep on doing this kind of shit as long as they see nothing but upside in it, never any downside.
And he got way more than $350k worth of favorable publicity with the RWNJs.
Christmas trees, Middleton? Those are pagan symbols.
Care to discus how the Christians at the Massachusetts Bay Colony fought a 22-year War on Christmas? They despised its pagan roots. So much so they enacted the "Penalty for Keeping Christmas" law in 1659, making it officially illegal to celebrate Christmas by feasting, not working, etc. They even arrested and levied a fine of 5 shillings (about $48 dollars now) for those who dared to celebrate. They finally repealed that law in 1681, but even after that Christmas remained unpopular throughout New England (it was seen as a "Popish" holiday celbrated by Catholics, Episcopalians, Lutherans and Methodists. Others like Congregationalists, Baptists, Presbyterians, etc. continued to shun it right into the 19th Century).
These were Christians persecuting other Christians, Middleton.
WHAT will trumpy give us?
https://scontent-ord5-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/471381558_1834607910658896_1467681554762918181_n.jpg?_nc_cat=108&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=127cfc&_nc_ohc=hX9ELtDTwu4Q7kNvgGGXN8f&_nc_zt=23&_nc_ht=scontent-ord5-1.xx&_nc_gid=A5HzSSYhulm5-LPN3w4Djp4&oh=00_AYC4dRgl0kCPSLqbd3KV68aQu4z2xls47Ts3seLDfb6TnQ&oe=6770C820
Are you even reading what you are copy/pasting?
That would be too much like work and it would just screw with his narrative.