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oraxx's avatar

Christians are fixated with indoctrinating young people because they know full-well if they wait until they're adults to push their message it will be ignored. Private schools, religious or otherwise, should not get one cent of public money, either directly or indirectly. These people operate under the delusion Christianity makes the world a better place, in spite of what history has to say on that subject.

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Troublesh00ter's avatar

Problem is, indoctrination isn't what it used ta wuz, not in the day of the internet and Google searches and the obvious greed and mendacity of the current crop (and multiple previous crops) of proselytizing evangelicals. They are getting more radical and crazy, and that hasn't gone unnoticed.

They've shot themselves in the foot and haven't even sensed that they have.

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Len Koz's avatar

And the money still gets wasted instead of helping the public.

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oraxx's avatar

I have maintained for some time that organized religion is going to have a hard time surviving the internet with it's influence intact. There is just too much easily accessable good information out there.

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Troublesh00ter's avatar

𝑇ℎ𝑒 𝑖𝑛𝑡𝑒𝑟𝑛𝑒𝑡 𝑖𝑠 𝑤ℎ𝑒𝑟𝑒 𝑟𝑒𝑙𝑖𝑔𝑖𝑜𝑛 𝑔𝑜𝑒𝑠 𝑡𝑜 𝑑𝑖𝑒.

-- Thunderf00t

It may take a while ... but he wasn't wrong.

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NOGODZ20's avatar

In an article to the Christian Post published 13 years ago, xtian apologist Josh McDowell claimed that the Internet was the greatest threat to Christians.

christianpost.com/news/internet-the-greatest-threat-to-christians-apologist-josh-mcdowell-says.html

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Zorginipsoundsor's avatar

“For 47 percent of Christian families, pornography is a major problem. Association of Divorce Lawyers came out and said that over 50 percent of divorces were directly related to pornography.”

https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/b8ac53a3d9b81fd1b2c997fce5f96e6f78952969dcc50c018b72efe3182efe6e.png

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NOGODZ20's avatar

Yeah, xtians don't do facts.

And should it be pointed out to him that the biggest consumers of porn in the US are bible belt states? Not just porn but gay porn.

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Ethereal fairy Natalie's avatar

That, and him banging the church secretary...

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S. Arch's avatar

Baloney sauce. The internet hasn't made people better critical thinkers. It has made them more gullible. Flat earthism and all kinds of wacko conspiracy fantasies are on the rise thanks to the internet. Online, the lure of simple misinformation easily beats the difficulties and complexities of truth.

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oraxx's avatar

The internet is indeed awash with nonsense, but it is also something that has allowed people from all across the free-thought spectrum to realize they are not nearly as alone as they once thought. This forum is a good example of it.

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S. Arch's avatar

Sure, there is a small community of secularists/nonbelievers/freethinkers, or whatever. I never there isn't. But that was not your claim. Your claim was that the internet will facilitate the spread of "good information" to such an extent that religion won't be able to survive. I think that's baloney. The internet strengthens communities of religious belief (along with conspiracy fantasies and other kinds of junk-thought) at least as much as it facilitates communities of rationalists/secularists/freethinkers.

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XJC's avatar
Nov 27Edited

All the information in the world didn't stop 'murica from voting R across the board. R=Jesus.

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XJC's avatar

But...but...inflation...the border...

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Zizzer-Zazzer-Zuzz's avatar

Eggs!

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S. Arch's avatar

Key word: "should"

Of course, private schools "should" not receive public funds. But "should" doesn't matter. All that matters is who has the political power to enforce their agenda. If we were going to talk about "should," then just go straight to the source and say people "should" not believe in ancient myths and superstitions. Then all these separation of church and state issues would go away in one fell swoop. But again, "should" is just wishful thinking. It's practically meaningless.

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S. Arch's avatar

Baloney sauce. The internet hasn't made people better critical thinkers. It has made them more gullible. Flat earthism and all kinds of wacko conspiracy fantasies are on the rise thanks to the internet. Online, the lure of simple misinformation easily beats the difficulties and complexities of truth.

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NOGODZ20's avatar

CARDINAL GLICK (George Carlin): "Fill them pews, people, that's the key. Grab the little ones as well. Hook 'em while they're young."

RUFUS (Chris Rock): "Kind of like the tobacco industry?"

GLICK: "Christ, if only we had their numbers."

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Janice Laz- Romo's avatar

👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼

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Joe King's avatar

The Christian Nationalists won't stop until they have all the money and power. This is just one more example of how they are shifting money and power away from the people and onto their theocratic hierarchy.

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oraxx's avatar

Even though church attendance is at an all time low and falling.

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Joe King's avatar

They don't really care about church attendance or even levels of belief. They just want the power and money. They don't care if the subjugated actually believe as long as the subjugated at least pretend and bow to them.

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Jacob Gardner's avatar

This is the truth. It’s not about true faith or belief. It’s about culture and identity wars. It’s about defining who is on their team, and who is not.

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Troublesh00ter's avatar

Only problem is that the Christian Nationalists will have to get in line behind Trump!

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Joe King's avatar

They put him there. They will try their damndest to hold all the puppet strings. They will eventually get pissed that they have to share with Putin.

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Jeffrey Peoples's avatar

They are already facilitating a genocide. "Christian Nationalists" are mostly Christian Zionists. Zionists have sufficient money and power such that they are carrying out a genocide with American taxes. The hierarchy already exists. Congress is passing legislation to criminalize disparagement of Zionism, a religious ideology.

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Ethereal fairy Natalie's avatar

And they are funding the illegal settlers.

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Jeffrey Peoples's avatar

Yup, the apartheid, the settlers, the genocide, all being funded by Christian Zionists and the U.S. Government. Ive written a small book that includes discussion of it.

https://minorityreport.substack.com/p/the-children-of-amalek

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RegularJoe's avatar

Sounds about Reich........

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Troublesh00ter's avatar

"After all, a building is secular, fixing a playground is secular, constructing a gymnasium is secular."

Sure they are ... but when they are in the service of a religious organization, they are no more secular than a church or a synagogue. To me, this is a direct result of allowing any kind of voucher system in the first place. That opened the door to more profligate efforts to divert public monies to religious programs, which was unconstitutional when it started and is still unconstitutional today.

And now that Trump will be in the front seat, crap like this will only get worse, and the fights to stop it that much harder.

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Val Uptuous NotAgain's avatar

They talk like the public school money is for the students. It makes sense when they look at the breakdown of how much is spent per student, which is an important metric, but it hides the purpose of public schools.

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Val Uptuous NotAgain's avatar

The purpose of public schools is not to instruct all the students, though that is what they do. It is to provide the community with a school. It’s to create an educated populace.

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Val Uptuous NotAgain's avatar

To give vouchers for schooling is like providing vouchers for other social programs provided by the government. I have a pool in my backyard, so I shouldn’t be funding a community pool.

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Val Uptuous NotAgain's avatar

If everyone who has a pool or swing set or treehouse in their yard got vouchers for their portion of the parks fund, we wouldn’t have a parks fund and those who don’t have these things go without entirely.

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NOGODZ20's avatar

"The Center for Christian Virtue..."

Christian virtue? BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

We have the recorded history of the Christian religion. Nothing about it is virtuous.

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larry parker's avatar

Just call them Madrasas and be done with it.

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Angela Headrick's avatar

Time to tax their churches!

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Jacob Gardner's avatar

Amen! If you use public money, you should contribute funds to public money!

This is not a complicated issue.

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Joan the Dork's avatar

The enshittification of education continues apace...

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larry parker's avatar

Enshittification is the opposite of embiggens.

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Whitney's avatar

So something I learned today: Christian values include lying and stealing. Okay, so yeah, I knew that, but I got a hard reminder.

Reading this article, is it any wonder people don't want to associate with churches anymore? Tearing down the education system and stealing public tax dollars to do it is never going to be a good look. The sheer selfish, prideful greed on display is appalling by itself, add to that the point that it's mostly children suffering as a result makes it far worse.

Christianity cannot die fast enough. Get well soon, humanity.

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XJC's avatar

I'd love to see a bunch of mosques and yeshivas built with Ohio taxpayer money, and the buildings stuck right in the middle of Christian Ohio communities. I assure you the outrage will be deafening.

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Jacob Gardner's avatar

The hypocrisy is astounding. Christians in America have been the majority and held the power for a long time, and thus have been behaving like power hungry wolves. They cannot see the harm their approach causes to non-Christian families. They are very blind to the suffering they cause around them.

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XJC's avatar

'course then Ohioans can take matters into their own hands, courtesy of their precious Second Amendment rights.

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Jeffrey Peoples's avatar

Zionist Yeshivas? Most Yeshivas are Zionist. And they are already being funded by American taxes over in Israel, which is carrying out a genocide with American supplied bombs, celebrated by Christian Zionists like Biden and Lindsay Graham.

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Matri's avatar

And you think Trump is going to put a stop to it? If anything, him and the Reichwing will double or triple their contributions to the genocide.

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Jeffrey Peoples's avatar

I certainly don't think that. I suspect he will just simply continue on what started with Biden, because both parties are captured by Zionists. Which is why I find it very strange that when I search for "Zionist" on this substack which is supposed to cover politics and religion, I get absolutely nothing. Zionism is by far the most powerful religious ideology in the united states today, yet this substack provides no coverage of it. Christian Zionists are the most powerful christian group in the country. And they are facilitating a genocide. As much as I oppose taxes funding religious school infrastructure, taxes funding a religious motivated genocide is exponentially worse.

It's possible having trump's face on the genocide may actually build more resistance to it than what was seen under Biden and would have been seen under Harris. The democrats and "liberals" who were able to somehow justify it in their mind while their preferred party was in the white house, may not be able to do the same thing when trump is in there. Their TDS may react when their conscience does not care.

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Ian D's avatar

Correct and deeply concerning because their fingers are closest to buttons labeled, 'weapons of mass destruction'.

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Kay-El's avatar

Well, this is a fine kettle of ichthys. If I ever have grandkids, I’d rather homeschool them than send them to an indoctrination camp. Funny how that actually flips the script from the reason religious nuts homeschool their offspring. At least mine would learn facts instead of fairly tales masquerading as reality.

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Bagat's avatar

You mean penguins waddling from Antarctica is not real???

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Kay-El's avatar

Actually, I saw a reel that showed a penguin on an Australian beach just enjoying the weather. 😆

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Val Uptuous NotAgain's avatar

I saw a documentary with penguins living in Madagascar renovating an old airplane.

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Zizzer-Zazzer-Zuzz's avatar

I saw a penguin on the telly.

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NOGODZ20's avatar

Did it lay and egg that fell into the back of the TV set?

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Len Koz's avatar

Did it take them 6 to 9 months or 69 months?

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Jeffrey Peoples's avatar

Public schools, regardless of state, have plenty of indoctrination. The solution to christian schools is not to coerce everyone to have their children attend public schools, but alternative charter schools that aren't christian that provide a superior education and environment.

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Kay-El's avatar

What indoctrination do you see in public schools?

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Jeffrey Peoples's avatar

Well, the pledge of allegiance to begin with.

Ethics and morality are taught throughout primary education, both explicitly and implicitly.

Political ideology is also cultivated.

And recently, at least in California public schools, some have begun to teach post modern gender ideology, which is often as irrational as Christianity. "Gender identity" is a metaphysical notion. There is no rational ground allowing gender ideology into public schools but not the bible, both are horseshit. Students living in China get indoctrinated with communist bullshit, and students living in America get indoctrinated with at times equal degree of bullshit.

Of course people believe those ideologies and think they therefore should be taught, but the same applies to Christians who believe their ideologies. The segregation of particular theologies as "religious" and other nonsense as secular is itself ideology -- it is itself religious. The first amendment likes to pretend there is a separation of church and state, but the state is a religious entity in its own. That sounds blasphemous maybe? If it does that is because you were raised in the American state religion.

Humans are religious creatures. Myself included.

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EllenThatEllen's avatar

And Ohio will get away with it too seeing that trump will approve of that.

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EllenThatEllen's avatar

And if a student criticizes the Bible in anyway in these schools? Freedom of Speech? Nope.

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Robot Bender's avatar

There sure wasn't when I was in Catholic school.

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Socratez's avatar

Robbing Peter to pay Paul undercuts public education!

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Troublesh00ter's avatar

True. Sadly, they don't care. Long as they can skim money from public funds for their hallucination, they're happy. Screwing up the public education system is just a fringe benefit to them.

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Socratez's avatar

A major objective to them!

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SPW's avatar

North Carolina is doing the same damn thing by funneling truckloads of taxpayer monies to vouchers and the private schools they support. It’s almost as bad or worse. The legislature seems to be full of those who would gladly throttle public funding altogether. It’s infuriating but there seems to be no way to stop the juggernaut as the state is so gerrymandered now that ejecting all these profligate voucher supporters will be next to impossible.

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Guerillasurgeon's avatar

What gets me is how blatant they are. And how active – they are actually seeking out ways to do this sort of thing, which of course involves lying, which should be against their religion. But we all know lying for Jesus is fine. And of course it's against the Constitution which they pretend to revere. If we needed any more evidence of how bad certain types of Christianity are, this is it.

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Len Koz's avatar

Certain types of Christianity?

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Guerillasurgeon's avatar

I'm reasonably okay with wishy-washy Anglicanism, even though they've had their problems with abuse, they at least pretty much mind their own business about what other people do with their wedding tackle.

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Len Koz's avatar

Cake...or death?

https://youtu.be/PVH0gZO5lq0?t=320

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NOGODZ20's avatar

Tax the damned churches. Every damned one of them. No representation without taxation.

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