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Troublesh00ter's avatar

𝑇ℎ𝑒 𝑠𝑡𝑎𝑡𝑒 𝑟𝑒𝑠𝑝𝑜𝑛𝑑𝑒𝑑 𝑏𝑦 𝑠𝑎𝑦𝑖𝑛𝑔 𝑡ℎ𝑒 𝑜𝑟𝑖𝑔𝑖𝑛𝑎𝑙 𝑟𝑒𝑠𝑡𝑟𝑖𝑐𝑡𝑖𝑜𝑛 𝑤𝑎𝑠 𝒕𝒓𝒂𝒅𝒊𝒕𝒊𝒐𝒏.

And we all know what tradition is: Peer pressure from DEAD PEOPLE. It's also the dodge that religion uses to insert itself into secularity, whether welcome or not, and in this case, clearly NOT. Justice Eddins clearly wasn't having any, and I thank and applaud him for his thorough and unforgiving statement on this issue.

It's way past time that SOMEONE stood up to the Roberts court.

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RegularJoe's avatar

Slavery was tradition. Disallowing women and minorities the right to vote was tradition. Also a rascally rabbi on the rafters fiddling around - yep, tradition.

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avis piscivorus's avatar

Feeding christians to the lions was once also a tradition.

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NOGODZ20's avatar

According to historian Candida Moss (author of “The Myth of Persection: How Early Chrisitians Invented a Story of Martyrdom”), the bit about xtians being regularly fed to lions is a gross exaggeration by believers and that it was a later embellishment of the actual suffering Christians endured.

When Nicene Christianity (Catholicism) became the state religion of Rome in 380 CE, xtians who were not Catholics suddenly found themselves accused of heresy, had their rights stripped from them and had their property seized by the state. For them, the Catholics were the lions.

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David Graf's avatar

While a corrective to the idea that Christians were being fed to the lions several times a day in ancient times, I think she goes a bit too far in the opposite direction after reading her book. Regardless, it's sad but expected that once Christianity became supported by the state that it embraced persecution as long as they could get away with it.

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Black Hole and DM mourner's avatar

Too far ? Like demonstrating that the story of Daria and Chrysanthus is improbable at best ?

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NOGODZ20's avatar

If it's a choice between an actual historian who knows what she's talking about because she did the actual research and a man who claims to be an academician but doesn't seem to know how being an academician works, I'll go with the historian.

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David Graf's avatar

Why not read the book like I did and come to your own conclusions?

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John Smith's avatar

Got any sources proving your point?

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David Graf's avatar

I would encourage you to read her book like I did and then review the responses from other scholars using Google. I gave my opinion and if you don't agree that's fine.

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Black Hole and DM mourner's avatar

Have you read the book dimwit genocidaire mention ?

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Ethereal Fairy's avatar

Thank you they so love their martyrbation, it is good to set the record straight. Facts matter.

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ShadowVT's avatar

Perhaps, but that was animal abuse.

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ericc's avatar

Tradition was the best way Alito could come up with to stop equal application of the religious parts of the 1st amendment to Christianity, but that is probably the only time they'll honor it. For example, the documented, traditional laws going back to the 1800s of towns outlawing gun carrying in town? That won't get the 'ok because tradition' defense.

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Septuagenarian Contrarian's avatar

"rascally rabbi on the rafters fiddling.." Oh now you have gone and done it! Now I can't get that tune out of my head. Thanks Tevya! Oy!!

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Matri's avatar

Also killing people who disagreed with you was also a tradition. So Charlie Kirk was tradition.

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RegularJoe's avatar

It's Biblical. 😁

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Kukaan Ei Missään's avatar

"And we all know what tradition is: Peer pressure from DEAD PEOPLE. "

It is also a logical fallacy, the argumentum ad antiquitatem.

(I tried to italicise part of the above text, in that I thought substack allowed one to use markdown, however it doesn't seem to work. Can one use markdown here?)

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Troublesh00ter's avatar

"If it ain't broke, don't fix it," "That's the way we've ALWAYS done it!" strikes me as the attitude of tradition. Thing is, ain't broke for WHOM?

And for italics and other font alterations, have a look at yaytext.com. I suspect you'll LIKE it! 😁

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Walt Svirsky's avatar

Oh man, I’m late to the party, but I’m loving everything about this. John Roberts is a domestic terrorist, period, exclamation point. Another judge just let him have it - both barrels - and it is glorious!

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NOGODZ20's avatar

Wasn't it Jesus-loving sugar warriors that came into Hawai'i and took it over? Look what happened to the native population and its land.

Christianity destroys everything it touches. Especially native cultures (as indigenous people of this country can attest).

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Daniel Rotter's avatar

Comment deserves an upvote just for the words "Jesus-loving sugar warriors."

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NOGODZ20's avatar

Wish I could take credit for the phrase. Somebody else came up with that genius observation. :)

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Septuagenarian Contrarian's avatar

You mean like the Dole pineapple folks.

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NOGODZ20's avatar

Indeed. Sanford P. Dole himself became President of the Provincial Government in 1893 following the overthrow of Queen Lili’uokalani. He became President of the Republic of Hawaii the following year and was ultimately appointed by then-President McKinley to be the Governor of the Territory of Hawaii in 1900.

I haven’t bought Dole pineapple in decades.

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Black Hole and DM mourner's avatar

Fun fact : Part of DM's family come from and around a town called Dôle in Jura 🤣

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NOGODZ20's avatar

Was going to post “Sugar, Sugar” by the Archies but then thought better of it.

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Hannah's avatar

Thank you. Some urges deserve suppression.

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NOGODZ20's avatar

I’m ashamed to say I know all the words to that song. 🙂

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Ethereal Fairy's avatar

There aren't that many as it is highly repetitive!

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Whitney's avatar

I don't do this much, but here we are.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=72kQl0P2n3M

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Linda's avatar

Indeed

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NOGODZ20's avatar

Um, what do xtians of any stripe need with land? Their book tells them to set their sights on things above, not earthly things.

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Sarah Longstaff's avatar

They don’t read their book. And preserving the parsonage tax exemption is a key part of their alliance with Right libertarians. Real estate investment is what drives the MAGA/Trump cult. Even Erika Kirk, grifting widow, is now into the real estate game. Trump Gaza’s not going to build itself.

Of course if the Rapture really is tomorrow 🤔 who’s going to oversee the Christian Zionist timeshare condo construction? Ah yes, the Dominionists, Dutch Reformed, prosperity gospel, and New Apostolic Reformation I assume will be staying here. And the Opus Dei Catholics will probably be Left Behind as well…. And the Kahanist Israelis. 🙄🤦‍♀️

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Hannah's avatar

dammit. I thought the rapture was today. Even wearing a special hat. Oh well next time.

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Ethereal Fairy's avatar

I bet you looked fabulous!

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Hannah's avatar

Yes, absolutely marvelous my dear

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Ethereal Fairy's avatar

I knew it!

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XJC's avatar

A ponzi scheme pyramid needs a foundation.

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Black Hole and DM mourner's avatar

Hey, two days in a row. Is the world ending ?

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NOGODZ20's avatar

It helps that Hemant's back on his schedule and all my weekend business is done. ;)

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Black Hole and DM mourner's avatar

No, twice in a row that we beat Oraxx.

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NOGODZ20's avatar

Ah!

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Stephen Brady's avatar

If someone in Hawaii appealed this up to SCOTUS, they would swat him down with glee. With their shadow docket, the Supremes are ruling by unexplained edict. We are no longer in a Constitutional Republic. It has been manipulated into an authoritarian dictatorship. We now find ourselves in the unhappy situation of having to fight to regain our former government by rule of law.

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ericc's avatar

This one's a double-edged sword. SCOTUS *could* smack it down by saying "if Hawaii allows secular restrictions on land use, it must also allow religious restrictions on land use like this one." But think about what that entails. The state can just as easily make a land use rule that says "no churches" as they can "only churches."

Though if the landowner is smart, they'll just build whatever it is they want and call it the 'Church of...' SCOTUS would be all over defending that.

IANAL but the interesting thing to me is this seems such an easy case to adjudicate, I'm surprised it even went to Hawaii supreme court. There was a 1922 agreement. In 1959 Hawaii's constitution entered into force, rendering it illegal. So it's just done. This is no different than the way some states had religious restrictions on jury membership etc. that got rendered illegal when the US constitution went into force. Going from a territory to a state changed some laws - duh.

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Linda's avatar

Yep. Sadistic SCOTUS is beyond compromised. I think boycott and strike is the most meaningful tool left at our disposal.

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Stephen Brady's avatar

I didn't phrase this very well - by 'him' I mean Hawaii Supreme Court Justice Todd Eddins.

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XJC's avatar

Dictator for a Day

Dictatorforadayshow.com

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Joe King's avatar

𝑇ℎ𝑒 𝑐𝑢𝑟𝑟𝑒𝑛𝑡 𝐶𝑜𝑢𝑟𝑡 𝑠ℎ𝑟𝑖𝑛𝑘𝑠, 𝑎𝑙𝑡𝑒𝑟𝑠, 𝑎𝑛𝑑 𝑑𝑖𝑠𝑐𝑎𝑟𝑑𝑠 ℎ𝑖𝑠𝑡𝑜𝑟𝑖𝑐𝑎𝑙 𝑓𝑎𝑐𝑡𝑠 𝑡ℎ𝑎𝑡 𝑑𝑜𝑛’𝑡 𝑓𝑖𝑡… 𝐼𝑡 “ℎ𝑎𝑛𝑑𝑝𝑖𝑐𝑘𝑠 ℎ𝑖𝑠𝑡𝑜𝑟𝑦 𝑡𝑜 𝑚𝑎𝑘𝑒 𝑖𝑡𝑠 𝑜𝑤𝑛 𝑟𝑢𝑙𝑒𝑠,” 𝑚𝑖𝑠𝑠𝑖𝑛𝑔 𝑡ℎ𝑒 𝑏𝑟𝑜𝑎𝑑𝑒𝑟 𝑐𝑜𝑛𝑡𝑒𝑥𝑡 𝑜𝑓 𝑎 𝑐𝑜𝑛𝑠𝑡𝑖𝑡𝑢𝑡𝑖𝑜𝑛𝑎𝑙 𝑝𝑟𝑜𝑣𝑖𝑠𝑖𝑜𝑛’𝑠 𝑜𝑟𝑖𝑔𝑖𝑛𝑎𝑙 𝑎𝑛𝑑 𝑐𝑜𝑛𝑡𝑒𝑚𝑝𝑜𝑟𝑎𝑟𝑦 𝑝𝑢𝑟𝑝𝑜𝑠𝑒𝑠.

So, standard operating procedure for conservative Christianity. Finally a sitting judge says out loud what we all have been thinking. The Roberts court is actively promoting Christianity above everything.

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Sarah Longstaff's avatar

If land can be permanently “zoned” for religion, then give it back to Native Americans! Get those colonists’ faces off Mt Rushmore and let nature turn it back into the Six Grandfathers. How many religious landmarks also of incredible cultural and historical significance have been sold off for non-religious purposes in this country? Read about Mormons’ massacres of defenseless Native women and children. Shame on them for trying to argue that they can determine what to do with stolen land.

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Jane in NC's avatar

The excerpts from this decision, especially the concurrence, are so delicious I'm going to make time today to read the whole thing. But first, standing O to the Hawai'i Supreme Court and Justice Eddins for saying what too many have been afraid to say: the US Supreme Court has made a mockery of the First Amendment's Establishment Clause with their stupid, partisan decision. 🙌 👏👏. And, gawd!, you gotta love how Justice Eddins strips the hide off the Red Court for its decision in Kennedy v Bremerton where they openly relied on made-up facts.

Second, John Roberts is steaming right now, but the one to watch will Sammy Thin Skin who even now is probably phoning around for an 'invitation' to speak at some right-wing legal venue so he can vent his spleen about these uppity justices in Hawaii.

Thanks for starting off my week with on a high note, Hemant!

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A.Gnosticthefirst's avatar

Hurrah Hawai'i!

A court that arbitrarily ignores stare decisis (precedent) cannot be trusted to interpret any constitution, let alone the complicated, multi-amended American constitution. Why do women not enjoy 'equal protection', but instead are subjected (in some states) to deprivation of body autonomy? Autonomy in reproductive issues seems to be a geographic lottery depending on the state a woman resides in.

The current Supreme Court, bulging with corrupt justices, can't even consistently adhere to its alleged Originalist reputation when it permits the repeated breach of the wall separating religion from the state.

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Troublesh00ter's avatar

𝐴 𝑐𝑜𝑢𝑟𝑡 𝑡ℎ𝑎𝑡 𝑎𝑟𝑏𝑖𝑡𝑟𝑎𝑟𝑖𝑙𝑦 𝑖𝑔𝑛𝑜𝑟𝑒𝑠 𝑠𝑡𝑎𝑟𝑒 𝑑𝑒𝑐𝑖𝑠𝑖𝑠 (𝑝𝑟𝑒𝑐𝑒𝑑𝑒𝑛𝑡) 𝑐𝑎𝑛𝑛𝑜𝑡 𝑏𝑒 𝑡𝑟𝑢𝑠𝑡𝑒𝑑...

↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑

THIS!!!!!

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Troublesh00ter's avatar

Also, Supreme Court nominees who say one thing during the nomination process, then DO THE EXACT OPPOSITE once seated as justices not only should not be trusted.

They should be IMPEACHED.

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Linda's avatar

I blame the many in the Senate who played dumb about who these justices were and what their mission was while approving them…Turning over Roe and keeping that ball rolling back civil rights for years to come. For anyone paying attention in the decades leading up to that point it was more than obvious. It’s a fucking insult.

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Troublesh00ter's avatar

Susan Collins was RIDICULOUS in her comments about Supreme Court nominees, and she damned well should have been defeated at the polls, yet she wasn't.

I'm still waiting for one or more Republicans to show some backbone and get in Trump's face. I suspect I will be waiting a while.

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ericc's avatar

It's all about personal power, isn't it? Many republicans become never-Trumpers...once they leave office and their job does not depend on his good will.

I expect the only way we'll see large numbers of sitting republican congresscritters show backbone is if he dies. There will then be the "what an awesome guy" memorial period, and then about an election cycle later all the people currently in office will be telling us how they never supported his crazy ideas and they were always trying to be the voice of reason. Vance will suddenly have always been a big supporter of Ukraine and Zelenskyy, and every GOPer in even the slightest purplish state will be talking about how they were always against tariffs.

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Len Koz's avatar

Is Peter Thiel pro-Ukraine? I thought he just wanted to replace what's left of our government with an overt oligarchy.

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Maltnothops's avatar

I am so hoping that Trumpism dies without Trump. But I’m less optimistic about that than I used to be.

My bride believes that DT Jr. is being positioned to take DT’s place in the MAGAverse.

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Linda's avatar

I can’t wait until Maine unseats her! 🤞

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Len Koz's avatar

Don't hold your breath.

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Len Koz's avatar

Maybe when arteriosclerosis finishes the job and Couch Fucker takes over.

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Maltnothops's avatar

Susan “I have serious concerns” Collins. Just never concerned enough to vote the right way.

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Troublesh00ter's avatar

If a woman can be a putz, she qualifies 100%!

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Len Koz's avatar

The same idiots who pretended RFK Jr. wasn't going to abrogate vaccines.

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Maltnothops's avatar

Unfortunately, I don’t think there were all that many who played dumb. 4-5 Republicans. The rest of the GOP got exactly what (they think) they wanted.

Although I’m open to the argument that lots of Repubs didn’t REALLY want Roe overturned; it was too good of a fundraising and political weapon to be gotten rid of.

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Linda's avatar

True. I guess I’m also blaming the Democrats as a whole for seeing this collision from miles away and allowing it to happen. I actually hold them more accountable. When so much money is involved, it clouds those minds.

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OwossoHarpist's avatar

"History is prone to misuse."

So does Science.

"The current Court shrinks, alters, and discards historical facts that don’t fit… It “handpicks history to make its own rules,” missing the broader context of a constitutional provision’s original and contemporary purposes."

Just like creationists.

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Troublesh00ter's avatar

OT: Anyone here miss Kat Kerr? Turns out Keith Olbermann just mentioned that she claims that "she was taken to Heaven to watch God present Charlie Kirk with a special tunic and a quiver containing 'one thousand arrows of light...'"

-- from the following article

https://www.peoplefor.org/rightwingwatch/kat-kerr-saw-god-present-charlie-kirk-one-thousand-arrows-light

I was kinda wondering when Quazy Kat was gonna show up again! 😝

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NOGODZ20's avatar

This was posted on another recent FA article (can't remember which one right offhand).

We took potshots at both these clowns. 🙂

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dammit barry's avatar

Quazy Quunt.

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Guerillasurgeon's avatar

Pink hair loony lady. Owen Morgan often critiques her on his Youtube.

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Ethereal Fairy's avatar

One of trumpolini's religious loony advisors.

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Ethereal Fairy's avatar

She is such a twat.

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dammit barry's avatar

Is she the one who was going to9 go through with an ectopic pregnancy? She claimed god will protect her and her baby?

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Troublesh00ter's avatar

Nope. She's the one with the pink / purple hair who claims all these weird visions of heaven. Total whack job.

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Matilda's avatar

Yup, daughter married a scouser (a Liverpudlian) where thousands, if not millions of soccer fans agree with Liverpool FC manager, Bill Shankly, 'Football (soccer) isn't just a matter of life and death, it's more important than that.' IIRC, one of Kerr's visions was that she saw cows playing football in heaven. In that case, I see millions of soccer fans worldwide reacting in horror at those pearly gates, if they see it's american football and not soccer being played in heaven for eternity!!

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dammit barry's avatar

Losing even more credibility. RFK jr and Uncle Dumpy claim Tylenol causes Autism.

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Daniel Rotter's avatar

George Soros has taken a lot of Tylenol. That's why he's the "Satan in the flesh" persona we see today./s

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NOGODZ20's avatar

Read that in my newspaper this morning. Not surprised at all.

What OTC pain reliever did a number on Brainworm Bob and Don the Con?

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Black Hole and DM mourner's avatar

Once, I put a pot of water to boil* and went to bed after taking paracetamol. It should be forbidden I tell you !

* True story. Without Aria** trying frantically to wake me up, it could have ended very badly.

** She was obsessed with patterns and regularity. Mommy who went to bed instead of staying near the stove was a deviation that was abnormal for her.

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Len Koz's avatar

I never thought I would see pyrotechnics at a funeral.

Well, at least until either Gene Simmons or Paul Stanley kicks the bucket.

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Ethereal Fairy's avatar

That reeked of WWE wrestling.

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Guerillasurgeon's avatar

She never!?

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Richard S. Russell's avatar

I wish he could've found a way to work in my favorite insult about the Subprime Court.

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Maltnothops's avatar

Not ready for prime time judges.

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Troublesh00ter's avatar

Hell, they're not ready for the morning farm report!

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dammit barry's avatar

SKKKOTUS tongues for TP?

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NOGODZ20's avatar

How many billions did ABC/Disney lose in the backlash against their stupidity?

Must've been a pretty penny, indeed.

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Troublesh00ter's avatar

I wonder if ABC has seen what Harvard and the Big Ten Conference have done in the face of Trump's threats. You'd swear they haven't learned anything.

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Maltnothops's avatar

I must have completely missed the Big 10 thing. No idea what they were threatened about (guessing DEI)

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Troublesh00ter's avatar

Yup. You DO NOT FUCK with the Big Ten!

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Maltnothops's avatar

Michigan was always my team. In the mid-1970s they found any number of ways to lose to Ohio State when the Rose Bowl was on the line.

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larry parker's avatar

I'll fuck with them. They can't count (18 teams).

Go Hawkeyes!

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Matri's avatar

Last I heard it was about $3.6b over a single weekend.

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Elizabeth Behnke's avatar

I grew up in Hawai’i but have lived in Arizona for the last 35 years.

The contrast between my original home state and my current one could not be more clear or cutting today: a justice of the Hawai’i Supreme Court correctly calls out the US Supreme Court’s ridiculous, corrupt, and politicized decisions on the same day 90000 people assemble in Glendale AZ to lionize and worship a divisive, bigoted, racist, misogynist asshole who was murdered while spreading hate and intolerance.

The world is weird. I have been on the Mainland so long that I am definitely a haole, but for all its failings, my home state of Hawai’i, through its Supreme Court, has done itself proud in the fight for democracy.

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Die Anyway's avatar

It is very discouraging to see 90,000* people celebrate their bigotry, racism, misogyny and various other forms of nastiness. Where did we go wrong that so many young people are proud to be MAGAts? 'Tis a puzzlement.

* I saw estimations as high as 200,000

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NOGODZ20's avatar

Where are these people whenever there's yet another school shooting that leaves children and adults dead and injured? Where are THEIR memorials?

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dammit barry's avatar

Are they Charlie's Kids?

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ericc's avatar

The far left is unpopular with the middle. I am not claiming these are mainstream liberal positions, but ideas like defunding the police, completely open borders, and firing professors for saying let your student peers decide for themselves if the want to wear offensive halloween costumes - stuff like this isn't popular. The GOP is great at pivoting away from their extremes when it's time to go after moderates. The Dems...not so much. A lot of liberals seem to have this idea that it's the worst form of betrayal - instead of just political tactics - to do such a pivot.

At least, that's my opinion.

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Guerillasurgeon's avatar

"Far left"? The Italian Communist party had 185,000 members just before it dissolved itself. There are about 15,000 communists in the US. There is no far left in the US practically speaking.

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ericc's avatar

The *more* left part of the liberal wing of US politics espouses policies that are unpopular with the middle. Is that better? Do you disagree?

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Guerillasurgeon's avatar

Yes I do agree. But not being American I wouldn't call them far left. Social Democrats maybe. I can never quite understand why people call them the far left – I guess comparatively speaking they are. I just got kicked off a website for expressing the same opinion, so it must be touchy point with you guys?

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ericc's avatar

Can't say why you got booted, doesn't sound like a good reason. At worst, your comment is just a nonsequitur (which IMO is far from a bootable offense).

Why a non-sequitur? US political fora discussing current events on political left and right are talking US left and right. It is a correct statement that Italy's communist party is lefter. Just like it's correct that the Tories are conservatives but less right than Trump, or Germany's AfD party is farther right. All those are accurate statements....that have zero to do with the question of why young folk in the US don't seem to be registering or voting for the US Democratic party as much as they have in past generations. To understand that, we have to discuss the US-style-left, not the Italian, UK, or German left.

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