293 Comments
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Elise's avatar

Meanwhile, the penalty for any abortion is 10 to life.

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NOGODZ20's avatar

Fetuses have more rights than 10-year-old rape/molestation/incest victims do.

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Joe King's avatar

"If you’re preborn, you’re fine; if you’re preschool, you’re fucked."

- George Carlin.

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John Roberts's avatar

"you’re fucked" George Carlin was right! 😄

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Troublesh00ter's avatar

More rights than WOMEN do. 🤦‍♂️

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Jodi Richard's avatar

Guns have more rights than women do.

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Juli Perry's avatar

Good for you, NoGodzz20. I’m a longtime supporter of AU.org. And the daughter of a Seminary prof in Homiletics.

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NOGODZ20's avatar

AU does extraordinary work.

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Hannah olufs's avatar

What is AU.

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Chris Titchmarsh's avatar

Penalties for medical procedures far more than not using medical procedures.

And RFK Jr will never receive any penalty for his advice leading to deaths. He got away with it once already. American Samoa, 83 counts. Going to be a lot more.

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Black Hole and DM mourner's avatar

Vs two accidental deaths due to a medical error.

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Dianne Marie Leonard's avatar

Wait til the deaths of kids not getting vaccinated in Florida. It'll make Samoa, and this case in Oregon, look like a garden party.

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Black Hole and DM mourner's avatar

Texass already have a head start.

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Henri Issacson's avatar

Thanks for expressing my same thoughts Elise.

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Zorginipsoundsor's avatar

And this was a post-birth abortion.

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Joe King's avatar

30 days in jail for killing an infant through neglect. If it had been any religious belief other than Christianity, they would have received the full five years. If the judge had allowed the plea deal. And when they said "everyone in the church should always seek adequate medical care for our children," they should have been required to define "adequate".

Christian Fucking Privilege needs to end.

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Walt Svirsky's avatar

I’m so sick and tired of children being abused, ruined and taken advantage of by their elders. I don’t give one shit about the abuser’s vocation, political affiliation or how much fucking money they have. If we can’t even make positive steps to improve the safety of our children, we are lost.

Then, of course, there is the judiciary, which is chock full of judges sympathetic to the plight of pedophiles. It amazes me that, somehow, they managed to advance to a position that made them stewards of the law! Now, when it is time to apply their years of expertise, we watch them ignore their responsibilities. We need sentencing guidelines with teeth and judges that will enforce them.

PROBATION MY ASS

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Black Hole and DM mourner's avatar

More than 5 years, the procurer would have found a way to count abuse charges as independent accusations.

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NOGODZ20's avatar

Words fail me right now. I'm that apoplectic.

If these two hadn't been Christian, they'd have had the book thrown at them.

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Walt Svirsky's avatar

What if they were people of color? They would be vilified and thrown into Alligator Alcatraz.

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Donrox's avatar

And this was Oregon, not Arkansas!

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NOGODZ20's avatar

Way too close for me.

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Hannah olufs's avatar

Stupid is everywhere.

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oraxx's avatar

There is no horror that cannot be, and has not been, justified in the name of religion. If it was up to me, they would have their children taken away, and would never set foot out of prison for the rest of their lives.

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Walt Svirsky's avatar

Now that makes sense.

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Paul Snyder's avatar

This checks out.

Once the kid’s out, it can be killed off in a variety of ways. Poverty, Military Service, etc. with no moral qualms.

If it’s In Utero, however…

Sanctity reigns supreme, regardless.

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Chris Titchmarsh's avatar

They don't give a shit about unborn babies. They are just a pawn in the Project 2025 power play. And we all know abortion will always be available on demand for the rich and powerful. Mother Teresa always had the best care while her victims did not even get an aspirin.

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Sarah Longstaff's avatar

Well they do care about babies: As future tithe-payers. Spy on pastors’ social media now and then. Right now there is discussion about how suppressed wages and the potential mass unemployment due to AI … will affect church financial resources. This discussion is happening in progressive churches, too.

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Juli Perry's avatar

Good for you, Paul.

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Paul Snyder's avatar

I don’t disagree with any of your points…

For me, however, brevity allows the absurdity of the situation to shine through. All the best.

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Troublesh00ter's avatar

Yet another Christian couple who think they're SO SPECIAL that their god is going to intervene on their behalf for an ailing child. Well, in THIS case, a child in such dire straits that medical intervention was a cast-iron necessity. It continues to astonish me that people maintain such a spurious belief, doubtless in the face of repeated failures of their deity to come through for them ("Oh, you didn't have enough faith;" "You didn't pray hard enough," et cetera).

And yes, they DID get off light, and HELL YES, local and perhaps state law enforcement needs to watch them like a hawk, for the sake of their other children. I would not consider them to be safe by any stretch of the imagination.

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Walt Svirsky's avatar

Why should we need to “watch” child killers anywhere but by CCTV in their prison cell?

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Troublesh00ter's avatar

WE don't, though I know Hemant may very well follow up on this story. Local law enforcement damned well SHOULD keep an eye on these loonies.

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Walt Svirsky's avatar

Now they HAVE to. There’s no indication that the parents have remorse or that they will change their behavior.

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Troublesh00ter's avatar

Entirely possible. They got off easy ONCE. If TWICE happens, the Edwards need to be landed on with both feet. They deserve no further slack, and indeed, they didn't deserve any the first time around.

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Black Hole and DM mourner's avatar

Remember the case in Australia with the diabetic little girl.

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Troublesh00ter's avatar

That was fairly recent, though I don't remember details. Still ... tragedies like these are happening entirely TOO OFTEN!!!

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Sarah Longstaff's avatar

Note that they have no plans to leave their church or condemn its teachings.

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Troublesh00ter's avatar

Oh, NO! Can't do that! That would be ... [GASP!] ... BLASPHEMOUS!

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RegularJoe's avatar

"They'll be in jail for a month."

They got their miracle.

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NOGODZ20's avatar

Isn’t xtian priviledge a wonder to behold?

I think I shall now be sick.

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Walt Svirsky's avatar

Muthafuckas!

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Lynn Veit's avatar

It's astonishing how so many people can be so delusional even when the lives of their children are at stake. I've lost count of how many tragic stories I have read that are similar to this one.

Back in the late 80's or early 90's, a TV movie "Promised a Miracle" told the story of a couple who not only let their diabetic son die by halting his insulin, but also expected him to rise from the dead "like Lazarus" and come home. SMH

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Boreal's avatar

They don't care or value life because all that matters is the afterlife.

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Chris Titchmarsh's avatar

They value their own lives though. Because somewhere deep down they don't believe in the afterlife either.

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NOGODZ20's avatar

An afterlife that is totally nonexistent.

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Chris Titchmarsh's avatar

Half the voters in the USA are living in a dream world. One where they are saving America.

The country will be gone before they wake up.

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ChaosMagnet's avatar

There was a similar case in Redding, CA around 7-8 years ago. Parents were part of one of those really weird churches - conservative xian, of course, and their little toddler daughter died after this candidate for ‘father of the year’ decided to rely upon gawd to cure her from some infection/virus (because of course the child’s mother didn’t get a vote; only dad!). They and their crazy enablers elected to keep the child’s dead, rapidly decomposing body in the un-air-conditioned church for weeks, asking for the other congregants to pray her back to life. In the summer. In California. Where it tends to be hot.

When that inevitably failed, they finally got her buried, but not until her body had been subjected to intense decomposition, would have smelled terribly, and would likely have attracted flies.

I can’t imagine doing something like that to the body of someone I loved!

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Val Uptuous NotAgain's avatar

There was also that couple who fed their dying child honey with spicy peppers and such while he was suffering lockjaw and seizures. I forget when and where, but they actively made his suffering worse.

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ChaosMagnet's avatar

I remember that one! Wasn’t there also one in Alberta or Saskatchewan where the evangelical/conservative xian parents had a kid who had type 1, insulin dependent, diabetes and refused to give him his insulin because gawd, I guess, and also physically beat the boy, verbally bullied him, scapegoated him, and starved him. He was less than half the weight that he should have been, had huge, deep bedsores, and some of his muscles were literally liquified at his death.

If I recall correctly, his religiously delusional ‘parents’ also did an infuriatingly, insultingly short prison sentence. Christian privilege sucks!

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Val Uptuous NotAgain's avatar

God just needed another angel. They prayed and god answered, no.

And now they’re martyrs for the church. Pretty soon they’ll be sainted.

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larry parker's avatar

Only 30 days is miracle #1.

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Randy J Henderson's avatar

I am a former child abuse investigator and worked for the Iowa Department of Human Services for over 22 years. I personally investigated cases like this and we had some cases of child endangerment due failure to provide medical care for religious reasons. In some cases the parents were charged and tried. I have never seen such a BS sentencing like this case. Children have died because of the prayer instead of medicine belief. It goes back to the likes of Jimmy Swigert and Oral Roberts and Benny Hinn faith healing crap. I came out of this Christain fundamentalist cult stuff and this "church" is the same type of cult. Shame on that court ruling.

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Walt Svirsky's avatar

With your real life on the job experience, it must really hurt to see these atrocities and watch them go unpunished, Randy.

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Sarah Longstaff's avatar

Good for you for sticking in the fight that long. My daughter’s high school friend had to have a bowel resection due to inflammatory bowel disease—that I have no doubt could have been prevented if her parents had taken her to a doctor earlier. But they were busy sending seed money to Ken Copeland. I didn’t have enough evidence, and at that point they had a Medicaid case manager.

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Chris Titchmarsh's avatar

Is it just me, or has time started flowing backwards in the USA? Is that Putin's plan to keep Trump in power for the next 60 years?

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Troublesh00ter's avatar

Trump's health being what it is, he'll be lucky to last 60 WEEKS, never mind 60 years. 😝

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Joe King's avatar

They'll just put him under glass like Lenin and give orders to the successors.

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Troublesh00ter's avatar

That didn't work so well after Lenin ... considering who followed after him!

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Lynn Veit's avatar

*sigh* There are cons to both sides. One Trump lives to traumatize and screw over innumerable people. Trump dies and we get the dead-eyed faux-hillbilly, who strikes me as just as vicious and evil and cruel as his superior, if not more so, and far more cunning.

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Walt Svirsky's avatar

It’s the Heritage Foundation that needs to die.

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Zorginipsoundsor's avatar

And the Federalist Society.

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Sarah Longstaff's avatar

The South Rises Again. It’s about White supremacy. MAGA Christians are the descendants of the very people whose churches taught that the Bible endorsed American slavery. They’ve just gotten better at hiding it. Now they are allied with White supremacist billionaires like Thiel. Faithful America’s Resources page has a good definition and a book list to get you started.

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Black Hole and DM mourner's avatar

They live a biblical lifestyle but "According to church members, children raised in the church attend public schools,"

I bet they also wear modern clothes bought in shops and not made at home by the girls/women. They use electricity and have cars...

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ericc's avatar

Cults are always irrationally selective.

That's part of how leaders check their control - to see if you will follow an irrational split. Of course we want our kids schooled in modern biology, we just don't accept the germ theory of disease.

...and as I write that, I realize we have a head of HHS who pretty much fits that description. Sigh.

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Walt Svirsky's avatar

I’m not sure RFK Jr fits any description. He may be the most bizarre person to ever hold a cabinet position. A man not even his mother could love, now a Greek god to the MAGATS. Thankful, he is only in charge of the insignificant task of managing the nation’s health.

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Sarah Longstaff's avatar

Not only are Kennedy, Means, and Oz pushing “terrain theory,” but so are social media algorithms. I tried searching YouTube for “everything wrong with terrain theory” and “debunking terrain theory,” and every result was pro-terrain theory. I mean, this is the main example that Medical Anthropologists use to explain our profession: “the population didn’t want to take anti-parasitic medications because they thought intestinal worms were as good for their guts as earth worms for the soil.” Now we have grifters and cultists saying “worms are good—our friend’s brain worm said so. So till your intestinal soil with our expensive probiotic ‘crop.’ You don’t need antibiotics or vaccines. Just be sure to take Ivermectin for the WRONG thing!” 🤦‍♀️

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Whitney's avatar

Um. I searched Duckduckgo for 'terrain theory' and mostly got pages for 'germ theory denialism.' Searching for something like that on YT is always going to yield odd results, their search engine is intended to make YT money, not find what you're looking for as far as I can tell.

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Hannah olufs's avatar

If your religion is more valuable than your children, let someone who cares about their well-being raise them. It's the ethical thing to do. Go to church and have a great time with your delusions.

Really enjoy that good feeling of magical thinking.

Just don't inflict it on the defenseless.

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Hannah olufs's avatar

Jaundice happens with newborns. It's treatable unless you ignore it. That's why you have to make a doc visit or get a midwife in the first 24-36.

Preemies have lung problems. Lungs are the last organs to mature. Again, mostly treatable and life threatening if not.

Storytime: During the beginning of the AIDS epidemic, I had a baby at 25 weeks. Baby needed blood transfusions, before you were allowed to give your own or a relatives blood. There were HIV transmissions in the community at the time and screening was years away.

For about 5 minutes I tried to get my own blood used, blood bank said no dice. The doc said he would take baby away right now if I didn't sign.

He was absolutely correct.

Really it took me a few minutes to realize I was too sick to make the right decision.

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Dianne Marie Leonard's avatar

Check out an article on the Science Based Medicine website (a couple of days ago) which discusses RFKjr's opposition to the germ theory of disease and where that comes from. I knew some of that info, but the article is qute thorough. The faith healers/child murderers are probably operating off similar beliefs, with a hefty dose of eugenics tossed in.

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Joe King's avatar

I wonder. If the kids from that church are going to public schools, are they vaccinated or are the the next measles outbreak waiting to happen?

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ericc's avatar

Well Oregon permits non-medical exemptions, so I'll bet dollars to donuts that they applied for and received one.

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Black Hole and DM mourner's avatar

Find me one reference to public schools in the bible. Excuse me if I go watch and movie and do some knitting whole you do 😁

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Troublesh00ter's avatar

One wonders if they brush their teeth daily...

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Black Hole and DM mourner's avatar

Look at their well styled hair* and beard*. They definitely do.

* Not biblical either. I' am willing to bet this Jezebel doesn't cover her hair with a veil, like it's prescribed.

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Troublesh00ter's avatar

Didn't Paul have a thing about women covering their hair? 🤪

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Black Hole and DM mourner's avatar

Being, allegedly, a Jew impregnated with Greek culture, the opposite would be surprising.

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Linda Bower's avatar

Not only is the antiabortion hypocrisy important to point out here, but also the disdain that culture in USA seems to have towards women who choose not to have children. I have been asked if I hate children jokingly but not jokingly on many occasions. They are so silly! I can use that “kid money” now to donate to organizations to help children already Born (which I do) and most importantly the cats 🐈‍⬛

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Black Hole and DM mourner's avatar

I love my niece and my nephew, and I can give them back to my sister. It's a win-win situation.

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James Scammell's avatar

Linda, what’s this about CATS ?

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Linda Bower's avatar

Where I live, there is between 500,000-1 million stray and feral cats living on the streets. Many were pets folks could no longer afford to take care of because veterinary care is too expensive like everything else. So, we cat lovers help out however we can 🐈‍⬛

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Walt Svirsky's avatar

This is OT, but, the corporate takeover of veterinary medicine has absolutely ruined it. No longer are Vet’s or their staff available after 5 PM for medical emergencies. Now, you must pay an extra

$500 to go to an after hours emergency hospital. That’s $500 on top of the charges for any care your animal receives. Offices are understaffed.

Appointments are weeks out. Just the way the corporate oligarchs like it.

Our Vet’s office went corporate (VCA) years ago and the service slipped significantly. Recently, our veterinarian opened his own office, without “corporate bottom line” oversight. I was overjoyed to move the accounts for both of my doggos to his new office. Now I can get appointments today or tomorrow with no problem. And yes, he’s available for health emergencies.

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Linda Bower's avatar

Yep yep! That’s why pets get dumped on the streets. You can’t blame them. Many will still try and feed their pets before themselves!

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Black Hole and DM mourner's avatar

DM and me would never have abandoned ours, and Aria needed 600g/1.5 pound of meat a day to maintain her weight.

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Troublesh00ter's avatar

We've had our vet for years now. The practice is both for house pets and large animals, and they have been TERRIFIC, caring and engaged.

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Black Hole and DM mourner's avatar

Wow. DM and me didn't pay that much when we had to call* Vetoadom, and they are expensive (but worth the bill).

*Like the time Aria cut the skin on Rhapsodie's head at past 10 pm. 10 staples and a bill between 350 and 400 €.

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Walt Svirsky's avatar

The cost of veterinary care is really out of control. Owners face very stressful decisions about medical care for their pets when the cost is prohibitive. Many animal owners are on fixed budgets. Thousands of dollars in veterinary bills create a tremendous hardship.

Another case proving that medical care FOR PROFIT is destructive.

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Runfastandwin's avatar

We haven't had any problems with VCA. I did not realize it was national. I thought the 2-3 in or area was it.

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Walt Svirsky's avatar

The people there have been great. I’ve been with my local VCA for years, since they bought out the previous owners business. The staff went with the deal, so, of course we stayed with them.

I know, I’m a boomer and lived in olden times, but it really wasn’t that long ago that veterinary clinics were accommodating to clients with pet emergencies. I’ve had it happen twice to my doggos and both times, VCA, who I had been with for many years (and many dogs) turned me away. The best they could do was see us in a day or so. No, they send you to their affiliated emergency clinic, where you need $500 just to be seen.

It’s obscene and it’s another corporate racquet.

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Whitney's avatar

Just wanted to add that what's happened to veterinary medicine is now happening in the medical fields for people, too.

Yep, I'm terrified.

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Chris Titchmarsh's avatar

I am a 🐕person, but I don't like to see any animal suffer.

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Sarah Longstaff's avatar

The neighborhood I briefly lived in in Florida was like the Warrior Cats novels.

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Black Hole and DM mourner's avatar

Another candle to add to those who died of a treatable condition/disease. One day, they will be visible from Mars.

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OwossoHarpist's avatar

All those times I've been told through church and in my late mother's local Christian radio station that children are precious in God's sight... until they end up abused in every way, like caged, beaten, starved, forced indoctrinated, called bad names that can be hurled to the likes of Stupid Idiot Dump and his terrible family (not named Mary Trump) who deserved all of it, allowed to die from preventable diseases, etc.

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Lynn Veit's avatar

Dump should be allowed to die of a preventable illness. Preferably a painful one.

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Walt Svirsky's avatar

Tertiary syphilis is hard at work in AnusMouthPantLoad’s tortured physique. Keep the faith, Lynn!

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Walt Svirsky's avatar

We now live in a pathetic, fascist nation where not even our children are protected against gun violence, religious zealotry and overwhelming stoopidity.

American exceptionalism? 😂😂😂

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NOGODZ20's avatar

Hey, We're Number 1!...in all the wrong places.

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Walt Svirsky's avatar

Ain’t that the truth!

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Die Anyway's avatar

And here I was thinking we were becoming a big pile of Number 2.

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Chris Titchmarsh's avatar

You are ahead of us in the UK. We have got 4 years before Farage has a real chance of getting to be PM. He has links to Putin too.

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Sarah Longstaff's avatar

Argh. Go read Carole Cadwalladr’s Substack. Britain still has that one law that says news has to be factual. But once that falls, bye bye secular UK.

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Black Hole and DM mourner's avatar

Guess who does too, even if she tries to deny it. It's just a coincidence, right ?

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Chris Titchmarsh's avatar

Marine Le Pen?

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John Smith's avatar

All extreme right wing parties in Europe are getting money and tech support from Putin’s Russia either directly or indirectly. If the extreme right wing parties get into power in European countries, they would withdraw from NATO and the European Union, therefore make it easier for Putin to influence that country or to invade (should the country refuse to deal with Russia).

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