Given the track record of clergy with unsupervised access to minors, this bill is a bad idea, even if the chaplains were qualified psychology counselors.
I just don't get the need for the legislation. Shouldn't all knowing, all seeing, all powerful Jeebus be able to waltz into the schools and tell the kiddies how and why he needs to be worshipped ? What purpose do these chaplains serve?
Anyone from an organization that has Abuse and Molestation Liability Coverage should not send a single person to a school with children of any age. I don’t care if they’re “qualified psychology counselors.”
If students want to meet with the clergy they have ample opportunity to do so without putting chaplains in the public schools paid for by everyone's tax dollars. It isn't as if this country suffers from a lack of churches. The people behind this measure would likely go out of their tiny little minds at the mere suggestion anyone but their own faith would be allowed to become chaplains. The overwhelming majority of the clergy are not trained counselors. This is a solution in search of a problem.
The problem is "not enough Jesus¹ in school". Next will be allowing ministers to be teachers...after all, they teach a thing called Sunday School, 's right there in the name.
(¹ Must be the right flavor² of Jesus.)
(² Blond, blue eyed, right-wing³.)
(³ None of that woke 𝒕𝒂𝒌𝒊𝒏𝒈 𝒄𝒂𝒓𝒆 𝒐𝒇 𝒕𝒉𝒆 𝒑𝒐𝒐𝒓 and 𝒉𝒂𝒏𝒈𝒊𝒏𝒈 𝒐𝒖𝒕 𝒘𝒊𝒕𝒉 𝒍𝒆𝒑𝒆𝒓𝒔⁴ nonsense.)
(⁴ Hanging with Prostitutes is still cool, just keep it on the down-low. 😉)
They don’t want prostitutes, they want teenagers they call prostitutes. See the MN legislator who was just arrested for soliciting a teenage girl the night after proposing his bill on Trump Derangement Syndrome. … and all the fucking GOP politicians everywhere (it seems like it anyway, there’s plenty of them to look at)
Ah, but the children who *don't* want to meet with chaplains must be forced to. So the school will first cut the budget for accredited social workers, remove them, and replace them with volunteer Christian priests so that the *only* person a kid can talk to is a Christian priest.
It's already happening. Hemant's OP is an example of it happening.
Another example is when the school goes from In-school secular electives -> you can also bus over to the church, but it's voluntary! -> teacher's can't teach anything critical while kids are doing the church elective, so no learning or education if you don't bus over to the church!
Once again, kkkonservative kkkhristians reveal their contempt for law of the land and the key founders intent for our secular government. The same contempt for the rule of law held by the current regime in DC.
Constitution 101: Separation of Church and State is a Constitutional 𝘱𝘳𝘪𝘯𝘤𝘪𝘱𝘭𝘦 embodied by the Establishment Clause and the Free Exercise Clause, working together. Even if (and that's a very big if) that was not the case, promoting religion by completly denying the Free Exercise rights of students and potential chaplains who have no belief in any supernatural power 𝘀𝘁𝗶𝗹𝗹 violates the First Amendment.
I don't think you are stupid. I think you are lying in order to move closer to an authoritarian far-right white Christian theocracy.
She's not that smart, but she'll do ANYTHING to get attention.
But something I was reminded of to point out to anyone who says "ITS NOT IN THE CONSTITUTION", you can say "NEITHER IS 'FREEDOM OF RELIGION', YOU DOLT"
She's 70 years old and convinced she's right, she's not about to let a little thing like 'reality' get in her way now. She's also convinced Trump won in 2020. At a guess, she thinks 'facts' must meet her standards, because she's not about to change her opinion.
Counseling troubled teenagers (volatile by nature, and just as likely to do the opposite of what they are told as not) needs extensive training (which is why there are psychologists that *specialize* in helping teens).
As far as needing Jesus for emotional or chemical issues, his track record has more failures than successes.
A kid come in complaining about being harrassed over being Gay. The passtor then says jesus hates him. So the kid gets hatred from kids and adults. How far away is the dreadful news that the poor kid killed his/herself?
That’s not fair. Just the other day, Jesus cured that guy in Arkansas of his addiction. Or maybe it was Alabama. Or possibly Texas. But it was definitely that guy.
He substituted jesus for his drugs. Now he is just another strip mall hellfire and brimstone hate-filled preacher. Never saw this phenomenon in any 12 step group.
I don't think Buddhists and Shintoists technically worship supernatural entities, so they'd be shut out too.
If it passes, lawsuit coming for sure.
The AZ caveat reminds me of the 'provided' caveat in Article 36 of the original Maryland Constitution - "nor shall any person, otherwise competent, be deemed incompetent as a witness, or juror, on account of his religious belief; provided, he believes in the existence of God, and that under His dispensation such person will be held morally accountable for his acts, and be rewarded or punished therefor either in this world or in the world to come."
As an aside, we should probably start using the phrases "this establishes religion" or "this prohibits the free exercise of religion" when arguing in front of state/local fundie conservatives, because those words and phrases literally do appear in the 1a.
“ As an aside, we should probably start using the phrases "this establishes religion" or "this prohibits the free exercise of religion" when arguing in front of state/local fundie conservatives, because those words and phrases literally do appear in the 1a.”
I want to emphasize this most excellent suggestion. A lot of these folk also think the bible is literally true and can’t think beyond that. So, yes, let’s use the literal phrases from the 1A.
This quote says it all. Rather have correction in the here and now, such judgment is supposed to happen in an inaccessible place at some undefined time ... MAYBE. Harris calls this concept on its bullshit and does so brilliantly.
OT. After many agonizing hours I have finally cracked the most important question of our lifetime, what's the difference between Trump and Yogurt - Yogurt is cultured.
As to Canadian oil, Trump fails to realize that it is logistics, it is financially advantageous to sell those 4.5 million barrels of oil to offshore customers at a higher price and buy from Canada at a lower price. This is not a trade imbalance, it is smart business, something Trump wouldn't understand.
At his level of weight, poor physical condition, junk food diet and lack of exercise, one can wonder if he can even reach his feet to put his socks and shoes on.
Trump decries science and modern medicine yet it's the doctors who are keeping him alive.
This bloated billionaire, who slashes healthcare for those who need it, receives the best medical care possible. For FREE! To coin a Trumpism: "So unfair."
I, for one, think it could be very education to have youth pastors in school. For example, in AP physics, they could use one of these youth pastors to illustrate Schrödinger's predator paradox. How can a high school youth pastor be both in school and at least 500 yards from any school, library or playground at the same time?
Given the track record of clergy with unsupervised access to minors, this bill is a bad idea, even if the chaplains were qualified psychology counselors.
It’s one stop shopping for the religious pedophiles.
It’s a pedophile buffet/feast.
But then again, completely on-brand for this religion and organization.
With the government stamp of approval. So victims won’t just be able to sue their church, but also their school district.
I just don't get the need for the legislation. Shouldn't all knowing, all seeing, all powerful Jeebus be able to waltz into the schools and tell the kiddies how and why he needs to be worshipped ? What purpose do these chaplains serve?
Their omniscient god doesn’t know anything without their prayers.
Their omnipresent god can’t go anywhere without them to shove it down our throats.
Their omnipotent god can’t do anything without them to takeover government and force laws on us.
Anyone from an organization that has Abuse and Molestation Liability Coverage should not send a single person to a school with children of any age. I don’t care if they’re “qualified psychology counselors.”
That’s an objective bright line! Who could possibly disagree?
If students want to meet with the clergy they have ample opportunity to do so without putting chaplains in the public schools paid for by everyone's tax dollars. It isn't as if this country suffers from a lack of churches. The people behind this measure would likely go out of their tiny little minds at the mere suggestion anyone but their own faith would be allowed to become chaplains. The overwhelming majority of the clergy are not trained counselors. This is a solution in search of a problem.
The problem is "not enough Jesus¹ in school". Next will be allowing ministers to be teachers...after all, they teach a thing called Sunday School, 's right there in the name.
(¹ Must be the right flavor² of Jesus.)
(² Blond, blue eyed, right-wing³.)
(³ None of that woke 𝒕𝒂𝒌𝒊𝒏𝒈 𝒄𝒂𝒓𝒆 𝒐𝒇 𝒕𝒉𝒆 𝒑𝒐𝒐𝒓 and 𝒉𝒂𝒏𝒈𝒊𝒏𝒈 𝒐𝒖𝒕 𝒘𝒊𝒕𝒉 𝒍𝒆𝒑𝒆𝒓𝒔⁴ nonsense.)
(⁴ Hanging with Prostitutes is still cool, just keep it on the down-low. 😉)
They don’t want prostitutes, they want teenagers they call prostitutes. See the MN legislator who was just arrested for soliciting a teenage girl the night after proposing his bill on Trump Derangement Syndrome. … and all the fucking GOP politicians everywhere (it seems like it anyway, there’s plenty of them to look at)
And there's a TikTok going around of an audio of a preacher telling men to go for the young ones, because "they don't know any better".
I'm sure he meant that in the biblical sense, or something...
https://www.tiktok.com/@amandawillgo/video/7467285366148451627?is_from_webapp=1&sender_device=pc&web_id=7408916045749274143
Well, that was fucking gross.🤮
Thanks for the warning. I won't watch it.
Sorry. :)
And the Christians can “train them up”.
²Male.
⁴ Females, prostitutes or not, they will carry the blame anyway.
I'm going to need a heirarchy chart at this rate.
Hanging out with prostitutes is okay with white male Republicans, so long as the prostitutes are also male. And the Republicans' wives don't find out.
Especially at Republican get togethers like CPAC. They say that Tinder lights up with people looking for gay hookups.
Ah, but the children who *don't* want to meet with chaplains must be forced to. So the school will first cut the budget for accredited social workers, remove them, and replace them with volunteer Christian priests so that the *only* person a kid can talk to is a Christian priest.
I would not be surprised if that happened. What became of the land of the free?
It's already happening. Hemant's OP is an example of it happening.
Another example is when the school goes from In-school secular electives -> you can also bus over to the church, but it's voluntary! -> teacher's can't teach anything critical while kids are doing the church elective, so no learning or education if you don't bus over to the church!
J'ai rien compris 🤔
If there isn’t a church on every corner, the Christian’s “suffer”. 🙄
So much persecution😏
It’s a problem in search of a bigger problem.
How about an amendment that says counselors must be from groups/affiliations that have NOT raped children.
That would make the baby jesus cry.
Unconstitutional as all get out.
Once again, kkkonservative kkkhristians reveal their contempt for law of the land and the key founders intent for our secular government. The same contempt for the rule of law held by the current regime in DC.
Ms Rogers:
Constitution 101: Separation of Church and State is a Constitutional 𝘱𝘳𝘪𝘯𝘤𝘪𝘱𝘭𝘦 embodied by the Establishment Clause and the Free Exercise Clause, working together. Even if (and that's a very big if) that was not the case, promoting religion by completly denying the Free Exercise rights of students and potential chaplains who have no belief in any supernatural power 𝘀𝘁𝗶𝗹𝗹 violates the First Amendment.
I don't think you are stupid. I think you are lying in order to move closer to an authoritarian far-right white Christian theocracy.
"I don't think you are stupid. I think you are lying"
Why not both?
Why assume ignorance when malice is obvious.
Indoctrination is one hell of a drug.
She's not that smart, but she'll do ANYTHING to get attention.
But something I was reminded of to point out to anyone who says "ITS NOT IN THE CONSTITUTION", you can say "NEITHER IS 'FREEDOM OF RELIGION', YOU DOLT"
Of course he is. I can see that from here. It is not hard to spot.
She's 70 years old and convinced she's right, she's not about to let a little thing like 'reality' get in her way now. She's also convinced Trump won in 2020. At a guess, she thinks 'facts' must meet her standards, because she's not about to change her opinion.
People like this annoy me no end.
ANY CIVILIZATION
WHERE THE MAIN
SYMBOL OF
RELIGIOUS
VENERATION IS A
TOOL OF EXECUTION
IS A BAD PLACE TO
HAVE CHILDREN.
-Charles Stross
Woof! Most excellent quote! [cut - paste!] Thanks!
Folks really need to think before voting for some clown who thinks a mythical character can do a better job than a trained psychologist. Delusional.
Arizona ranks 44th in Education. We can see why.
Counseling troubled teenagers (volatile by nature, and just as likely to do the opposite of what they are told as not) needs extensive training (which is why there are psychologists that *specialize* in helping teens).
As far as needing Jesus for emotional or chemical issues, his track record has more failures than successes.
A kid come in complaining about being harrassed over being Gay. The passtor then says jesus hates him. So the kid gets hatred from kids and adults. How far away is the dreadful news that the poor kid killed his/herself?
Which is why I donate to:
https://www.thetrevorproject.org/ - https://chat.trvr.org/ - 1-866-488-7386 - sms:678678
WHEN wiloll they end up firebombed by a god-fearing kkkrister ending perversion in kids?
That’s not fair. Just the other day, Jesus cured that guy in Arkansas of his addiction. Or maybe it was Alabama. Or possibly Texas. But it was definitely that guy.
Well, a fatal overdose is 𝘰𝘯𝘦 kind of a cure.
You’ll never use drugs again when you do that.
He substituted jesus for his drugs. Now he is just another strip mall hellfire and brimstone hate-filled preacher. Never saw this phenomenon in any 12 step group.
*Jesus* seems to have done just fine with the 12 people he counseled.
His followers living 2000 years later, on the other hand...
Someone, somewhere, perfectly cropped this picture: https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/5ff096e5d1264b9f80921c7c26bf6310115d7c501a8105c0cd552de215db676f.jpg
Herr Plugs.
Big Smile! Big Smile! BIG SMILE!
Edit: I put this up before even clicking on Len's link! GMTA, eh?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=saCNObW9Uao
I don't think Buddhists and Shintoists technically worship supernatural entities, so they'd be shut out too.
If it passes, lawsuit coming for sure.
The AZ caveat reminds me of the 'provided' caveat in Article 36 of the original Maryland Constitution - "nor shall any person, otherwise competent, be deemed incompetent as a witness, or juror, on account of his religious belief; provided, he believes in the existence of God, and that under His dispensation such person will be held morally accountable for his acts, and be rewarded or punished therefor either in this world or in the world to come."
As an aside, we should probably start using the phrases "this establishes religion" or "this prohibits the free exercise of religion" when arguing in front of state/local fundie conservatives, because those words and phrases literally do appear in the 1a.
“ As an aside, we should probably start using the phrases "this establishes religion" or "this prohibits the free exercise of religion" when arguing in front of state/local fundie conservatives, because those words and phrases literally do appear in the 1a.”
I want to emphasize this most excellent suggestion. A lot of these folk also think the bible is literally true and can’t think beyond that. So, yes, let’s use the literal phrases from the 1A.
Where is 'jesus" when christian/republican perverts are raping children?
𝑌𝑜𝑢 𝑒𝑖𝑡ℎ𝑒𝑟 ℎ𝑎𝑣𝑒 𝑎 𝐺𝑜𝑑 𝑤ℎ𝑜 𝑠𝑒𝑛𝑑𝑠 𝑐ℎ𝑖𝑙𝑑 𝑟𝑎𝑝𝑖𝑠𝑡𝑠 𝑡𝑜 𝑟𝑎𝑝𝑒 𝑐ℎ𝑖𝑙𝑑𝑟𝑒𝑛 𝑜𝑟 𝑦𝑜𝑢 ℎ𝑎𝑣𝑒 𝑎 𝐺𝑜𝑑 𝑤ℎ𝑜 𝑠𝑖𝑚𝑝𝑙𝑦 𝑤𝑎𝑡𝑐ℎ𝑒𝑠 𝑖𝑡 𝑎𝑛𝑑 𝑠𝑎𝑦𝑠, “𝑊ℎ𝑒𝑛 𝑦𝑜𝑢’𝑟𝑒 𝑑𝑜𝑛𝑒, 𝐼’𝑚 𝑔𝑜𝑖𝑛𝑔 𝑡𝑜 𝑝𝑢𝑛𝑖𝑠ℎ 𝑦𝑜𝑢.” 𝐼𝑓 𝐼 𝑐𝑜𝑢𝑙𝑑 𝑠𝑡𝑜𝑝 𝑎 𝑝𝑒𝑟𝑠𝑜𝑛 𝑓𝑟𝑜𝑚 𝑟𝑎𝑝𝑖𝑛𝑔 𝑎 𝑐ℎ𝑖𝑙𝑑, 𝐼 𝑤𝑜𝑢𝑙𝑑. 𝑇ℎ𝑎𝑡’𝑠 𝑡ℎ𝑒 𝑑𝑖𝑓𝑓𝑒𝑟𝑒𝑛𝑐𝑒 𝑏𝑒𝑡𝑤𝑒𝑒𝑛 𝑚𝑒 𝑎𝑛𝑑 𝑦𝑜𝑢𝑟 𝐺𝑜𝑑.
-- Tracie Harris
This quote says it all. Rather have correction in the here and now, such judgment is supposed to happen in an inaccessible place at some undefined time ... MAYBE. Harris calls this concept on its bullshit and does so brilliantly.
Saving that one.
in the corner wanking off.
OT. After many agonizing hours I have finally cracked the most important question of our lifetime, what's the difference between Trump and Yogurt - Yogurt is cultured.
As to Canadian oil, Trump fails to realize that it is logistics, it is financially advantageous to sell those 4.5 million barrels of oil to offshore customers at a higher price and buy from Canada at a lower price. This is not a trade imbalance, it is smart business, something Trump wouldn't understand.
At his level of stupidity and incompetence one can wonder if he ever learned to lace his shoes.
At his level of weight, poor physical condition, junk food diet and lack of exercise, one can wonder if he can even reach his feet to put his socks and shoes on.
He’s marveling at Barron being able to turn off and on his laptop. He’s not long for this world. The sooner the better.
Dude doesn't know how a laptop works, yet he has access to the nuclear codes. JFC, we are sooo fucked.
One can also wonder why the hell he hasn't suffered a heart attack or stroke.
I certainly do, I bet that is why he will not release his medical records, multiple strokes would be my guess.
Trump decries science and modern medicine yet it's the doctors who are keeping him alive.
This bloated billionaire, who slashes healthcare for those who need it, receives the best medical care possible. For FREE! To coin a Trumpism: "So unfair."
Sad.
He's got people for that.
Worst. Job. Ever. Except for whoever has to change his diaper.
He puts lifts in his slip-ons.
His shoes have Velcro straps.
https://lovedeathrobots.fandom.com/wiki/When_the_Yogurt_Took_Over
I, for one, think it could be very education to have youth pastors in school. For example, in AP physics, they could use one of these youth pastors to illustrate Schrödinger's predator paradox. How can a high school youth pastor be both in school and at least 500 yards from any school, library or playground at the same time?
Educational, not education. Did a youth pastor teach you that?
I got my very education in Alabama. me learned good words.
High Tide! High Tide!!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cfJnJv3s_Vc
Those poor, persecuted Christians. Will they EVER get justice? :S
1. I too believe in the great replacement theory: replace all these jackasses with competent legislators
2. Oh no! I have a spiritual deficit and I still turned out to be a decent human being.
You can be a good human being, or you can be a good superstitionist. You CANNOT be both.