Aren’t the churches and synagogues enough to get their messages out? Why are they expecting tax payers to do for them what they have clearly failed to do for themselves? It is NEVER the job of our secular government to backstop anyone’s religion. Religious schools should never get a penny of public money for any reason.
When a religion is good, I conceive it will support itself; and when it does not support itself, and God does not take care to support it so that its professors are obliged to call for help of the civil power, 'tis a sign, I apprehend, of its being a bad one.
Could be, though it would be a bit long. I STILL like 𝐸 𝑃𝑙𝑢𝑟𝑖𝑏𝑢𝑠 𝑈𝑛𝑢𝑚, and I STILL think we never should have allowed that In God We Trust crap on ANYTHING, let alone our money.
"E pluribus unum"? But that's foreign. You wouldn't want something in foreign on your currency, would you?
Over here our coins have "DEI GRA(TIA) REG(INA)* FID(EI) DEF(ENSOR)". The fid def was a title awarded to Henry VIII by the, then current, Pope for Hank's publication of a defence of the RCC. The fact that Hank then broke with the church and made himself head thus clearing the way for a complete break and creating the C of E (Protestant) was conveniently forgotten.
* I presume the new ones will have REX but I do not have one to hand, and precious few of the old ones, too.
One would think that quote would have gotten worn out ... except that it is TRUE, and maybe I'm being a bit Pollyanna-ish here, but I think that the truth endures.
So, if you treat all religions equally and reject all religions from participation in feeding at the public trough for private and sectarian purposes, is that discrimination on the basis of religious belief, or is it saying that church and state should be separate?
And if you treat Jewish schools the same way that you treat Christian schools, is that antisemitism or is that saying at church and state should be separate?
And if you say over and over again that you are tired of jihadis, zionists, hindu nationalists, rad trads, christian dominionists, and Nat-C’s—theocraps of every stripe— are you discriminating against any of them or merely saying that church and state should be separate?
Power, money, and Dominion: these are the goals of modern religion. And they want everyone else to pay for it.
And they think that, because they are supposedly RIGHTEOUS and good as a matter of course and by their lights the backbone of the United States, that they deserve and are due that money.
Oh, of COURSE not! Didn't their savior say that one cannot serve both God and Mammon? [smirk - smirk ... GUFFAW!!!] Oh, hell, their god has been money / Mammon from the get-go!
They all fracture into sects pretty easily, but ‘Christianity’ with its 45,000+ sects is simply absurd, since most of them are mutually incompatible with the others. Paul complains about ‘False preachers’ and ‘Christ mongers’. They have a major issue with their messaging.
I had an espresso, I probably would’ve gone into one of my rants. As it was, my coffee was a lot stronger than usual. I usually have 3 cups in the morning, but I stopped at two.
Personally I'd care a whole lot less if private religious schools were available via voucher programs, if they met all the state curriculum, licensing, and employment standards of public schools (and private secular schools should meet them too). Teach the right classes the right way. Hire licensed teachers. Give them standard health care and retirement packages etc. Then if you want to tack on an 8th period bible study entirely separate from the standard curriculum and have a chapel in the building and a Christian club after school, well I don't *like* voucher programs at all...but so long as my state is running one, then to me such a religious school seems as entitled as any secular private school to participate in it.
IOW, any voucher school should function as "we do our own stuff...PLUS provide a public education" not "we do our own stuff...INSTEAD OF providing a public education." If you want a private school to do the latter, that should be on your own dime.
“I don't know how you feel, but I'm pretty sick of church people. You know what they ought to do with churches? Tax them. If holy people are so interested in politics, government, and public policy, let them pay the price of admission like everybody else. The Catholic Church alone could wipe out the national debt if all you did was tax their real estate.”
Can you imagine the tax revenue New York could get from a large building on Fifth Avenue, located on a major piece of property across the street from Rockefeller Center? That is where St. Patrick's Cathedral free loads.
An architecture studio I worked at did the recent St. Patrick’s renovation/restoration and cleaning. They took the whole team up into the attic of the cathedral 😂. Spooky place in more ways than one.
A family run legacy firm that stretches back a hundred years or more. They work on just about all the churches in the city ;) I even specified a confessional chair! 😂
Public money does NOT belong in private schools, and particularly not in private RELIGIOUS schools. That should not be a controversial statement, and yet in the US, it is violated in multiple places, my home state of Ohio being one of them. Oklahoma should not be allowed to add itself to the list of violators.
Public money does not belong in private schools, but public oversight does. Private schools should be held to a minimum educational standard, the same way public schools are.
What in the Handmaids Tale is going on over there in Ohio? It probably won’t pass, but alarming nonetheless.
A recently introduced bill in the Ohio House of Representatives, House Bill 754 (HB 754), proposes to create a "certificate of life" for pregnancies and track their outcomes. Introduced by Republican Representative Jean Schmidt in March 2026, the legislation would require medical professionals to file a record with the state within 10 days of detecting a fetal heartbeat.
No shit, it's alarming, never mind the other religious crap that goes on here. I recently read somewhere that there is a religious lobbying group that is located, allegedly, RIGHT ACROSS THE STREET from the Ohio capital building, and they have been BUSY.
And apparently Ohio lawmakers don't give a ripe dump about State / Church separation.
That should have been his first hint to drip the whole thing. If the community you claim to serve tells you they don't want you to, it's time to consider what the real reason you're there is.
Can you say evangelical Trojan Horse? I knew you could.
Mor(m)ons didn't want black people in their priesthood or doing temple stuff until 1978 when the LDS (via their President Spencer W. Kimball) suddenly received a "revelation" after 148 years.
Bet it had something to with ongoing protests and boycotts, not to mention legal issues. Not compassion or received wisdom.
This reminds me of the time I turned in a literal pile of shit for my American History essay. Sure it obvious had a bunch of flaws, like it was literally a pile of shit, instead of a 10,000 word essay on how the corruption of the political corruption of the early twenty century effected the response to great depression, and I understand why it got a failing grade. But since, Mr. Cooligen didn't describe why each peanut embedded in the shit deserves a failing grade, I demand it be regraded!
Yet another great reason to keep religion out of education.
The reality here is that we have a group of religious people who want to take taxpayer dollars for themselves and leave the taxpayer holding the bag. It's theft - outright stealing - and it's a shame it doesn't get called that more often. Kudos to Mr. Drummond for holding the school board's feet to that fire, would that we had more AGs willing to pursue these matters.
I am... genuinely surprised to see something this clever, and this seemingly well-intentioned, coming out of a red state AG. I don't get to put on my 𝘩𝘰𝘯𝘦𝘴𝘵𝘭𝘺 shocked face very often around here, but... hey, lookit that, it still fits! Bit dusty. Should've at least cleaned it more often.
I will spare my sanity by not looking into the rest of this guy's record, and pretend for 𝘫𝘶𝘴𝘵 𝘢 𝘮𝘰𝘮𝘦𝘯𝘵 that he might be one of those vanishingly rare Republicans with more than just vestigial senses of professional ethics and civic responsibility.
Best not to look. It’s like people praising Tucker Carlson for his views on the war and forgetting all about his “Great Replacement” theory here at home.
Gosh, I wonder what they’re trying to do. Using one of the board members of the Catholic charter school to get this Jewish school to be approved. How magnanimous of him.
If the religious zealots can’t wring money from the public for their indoctrination, then they’ll waste it on lawsuits. I suppose they consider that a win-win because it never seems to end. 🙄
Religious education must be one of the BIGGEST oxymoron out there! Half the time these religious schools don’t teach the proper educational curriculum, but teach outside the rules such as creationism in science class, Bible as actual history, etc. so the students are unable to cope with the modern world, and the only job they can get includes the phrase “Do you want fries with that?”.
Let religious institutions pay their own way on things they want. Since they pay no taxes, they don't get to put their hands on taxpayer dollars.
Paging Mr. Franklin, Mr. Benjamin Franklin...
Edit: I should have read further before posting this.
Aren’t the churches and synagogues enough to get their messages out? Why are they expecting tax payers to do for them what they have clearly failed to do for themselves? It is NEVER the job of our secular government to backstop anyone’s religion. Religious schools should never get a penny of public money for any reason.
𝗖𝗨𝗘 𝗧𝗛𝗘 𝗕𝗘𝗡 𝗙𝗥𝗔𝗡𝗞𝗟𝗜𝗡 𝗤𝗨𝗢𝗧𝗘 𝗔𝗕𝗢𝗨𝗧 𝗥𝗘𝗟𝗜𝗚𝗜𝗢𝗡 𝗔𝗚𝗔𝗜𝗡!!! 😁
(Here you go)
When a religion is good, I conceive it will support itself; and when it does not support itself, and God does not take care to support it so that its professors are obliged to call for help of the civil power, 'tis a sign, I apprehend, of its being a bad one.
Gee whiz! I thought everyone had already memorized it! [chuckle!]
It ought to be on our currency.
Could be, though it would be a bit long. I STILL like 𝐸 𝑃𝑙𝑢𝑟𝑖𝑏𝑢𝑠 𝑈𝑛𝑢𝑚, and I STILL think we never should have allowed that In God We Trust crap on ANYTHING, let alone our money.
"E pluribus unum"? But that's foreign. You wouldn't want something in foreign on your currency, would you?
Over here our coins have "DEI GRA(TIA) REG(INA)* FID(EI) DEF(ENSOR)". The fid def was a title awarded to Henry VIII by the, then current, Pope for Hank's publication of a defence of the RCC. The fact that Hank then broke with the church and made himself head thus clearing the way for a complete break and creating the C of E (Protestant) was conveniently forgotten.
* I presume the new ones will have REX but I do not have one to hand, and precious few of the old ones, too.
We did. :)
One would think that quote would have gotten worn out ... except that it is TRUE, and maybe I'm being a bit Pollyanna-ish here, but I think that the truth endures.
So, if you treat all religions equally and reject all religions from participation in feeding at the public trough for private and sectarian purposes, is that discrimination on the basis of religious belief, or is it saying that church and state should be separate?
And if you treat Jewish schools the same way that you treat Christian schools, is that antisemitism or is that saying at church and state should be separate?
And if you say over and over again that you are tired of jihadis, zionists, hindu nationalists, rad trads, christian dominionists, and Nat-C’s—theocraps of every stripe— are you discriminating against any of them or merely saying that church and state should be separate?
Power, money, and Dominion: these are the goals of modern religion. And they want everyone else to pay for it.
All of that on one cup of coffee.
And they think that, because they are supposedly RIGHTEOUS and good as a matter of course and by their lights the backbone of the United States, that they deserve and are due that money.
They are sadly and badly mistaken.
Surely you are not saying that their actual God is money.
Oh, of COURSE not! Didn't their savior say that one cannot serve both God and Mammon? [smirk - smirk ... GUFFAW!!!] Oh, hell, their god has been money / Mammon from the get-go!
Even Jesus was for church/state separation ("Render unto.." and all that).
All religion continues to be CAFETERIA religion ... and Christians continue to pick and choose as they please. It's beyond absurd.
They all fracture into sects pretty easily, but ‘Christianity’ with its 45,000+ sects is simply absurd, since most of them are mutually incompatible with the others. Paul complains about ‘False preachers’ and ‘Christ mongers’. They have a major issue with their messaging.
They were talking about coffee.
Good thing you didn't have an espresso.
I had an espresso, I probably would’ve gone into one of my rants. As it was, my coffee was a lot stronger than usual. I usually have 3 cups in the morning, but I stopped at two.
> "I usually have 3 cups in the morning..."
One bourbon, one scotch, and one beer.
No alcohol during the day for me.
Right. I was talking about me.
🎶 So pour me somethin' tall and strong
Make it a "Hurricane" before I go insane
It's only half past twelve but I don't care
It's five o'clock somewhere 🎶
If you can manage it, more power to you. It just puts me to sleep.
Oh, hell, I'd gladly buy Ben an espresso ... or whatever he'd like, given a chance. I mean, why not, just for the sake of intelligent conversation!
Why, thank you!
Personally I'd care a whole lot less if private religious schools were available via voucher programs, if they met all the state curriculum, licensing, and employment standards of public schools (and private secular schools should meet them too). Teach the right classes the right way. Hire licensed teachers. Give them standard health care and retirement packages etc. Then if you want to tack on an 8th period bible study entirely separate from the standard curriculum and have a chapel in the building and a Christian club after school, well I don't *like* voucher programs at all...but so long as my state is running one, then to me such a religious school seems as entitled as any secular private school to participate in it.
IOW, any voucher school should function as "we do our own stuff...PLUS provide a public education" not "we do our own stuff...INSTEAD OF providing a public education." If you want a private school to do the latter, that should be on your own dime.
Sad but true..
The Abrahamic cults needs young, vulnerable minds to maintain a steady supply of victims and tithes.
Bureaucratic institutions are inherently self-preserving.
Shall I say it? I think I shall.
Tax the churches, synagogues, mosques, temples, etc. They wanna play? Let them pay.
“I don't know how you feel, but I'm pretty sick of church people. You know what they ought to do with churches? Tax them. If holy people are so interested in politics, government, and public policy, let them pay the price of admission like everybody else. The Catholic Church alone could wipe out the national debt if all you did was tax their real estate.”
-George Carlin
Agreed, tax the fucken churches! Frank Zappa-1980
Can you imagine the tax revenue New York could get from a large building on Fifth Avenue, located on a major piece of property across the street from Rockefeller Center? That is where St. Patrick's Cathedral free loads.
An architecture studio I worked at did the recent St. Patrick’s renovation/restoration and cleaning. They took the whole team up into the attic of the cathedral 😂. Spooky place in more ways than one.
A family run legacy firm that stretches back a hundred years or more. They work on just about all the churches in the city ;) I even specified a confessional chair! 😂
No I try not to eat too much junk food!
youtu.be/Wh3t49NsWBA
Public money does NOT belong in private schools, and particularly not in private RELIGIOUS schools. That should not be a controversial statement, and yet in the US, it is violated in multiple places, my home state of Ohio being one of them. Oklahoma should not be allowed to add itself to the list of violators.
And with luck and this lawsuit, it won't be.
Public money does not belong in private schools, but public oversight does. Private schools should be held to a minimum educational standard, the same way public schools are.
Yer damned skippy they should! People should know if they're being ripped off, ESPECIALLY as regards education.
What in the Handmaids Tale is going on over there in Ohio? It probably won’t pass, but alarming nonetheless.
A recently introduced bill in the Ohio House of Representatives, House Bill 754 (HB 754), proposes to create a "certificate of life" for pregnancies and track their outcomes. Introduced by Republican Representative Jean Schmidt in March 2026, the legislation would require medical professionals to file a record with the state within 10 days of detecting a fetal heartbeat.
No shit, it's alarming, never mind the other religious crap that goes on here. I recently read somewhere that there is a religious lobbying group that is located, allegedly, RIGHT ACROSS THE STREET from the Ohio capital building, and they have been BUSY.
And apparently Ohio lawmakers don't give a ripe dump about State / Church separation.
Yikes! Hang in there
https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRq-G_ZeMq9NQzavUgO-eIx_ArUsRmt6QZg1Q&s
Never mind creating adults who either cannot or will not take responsibility for their own actions.
But it does teach them to blame others and accuse people of the imaginary crime of sin.
And to have imaginary enemies!
[𝑇]ℎ𝑒 𝑠𝑐ℎ𝑜𝑜𝑙’𝑠 𝑓𝑜𝑢𝑛𝑑𝑒𝑟 𝑎𝑑𝑚𝑖𝑡𝑡𝑒𝑑 𝑡𝑜 𝑡ℎ𝑒 𝑏𝑜𝑎𝑟𝑑 𝑡ℎ𝑎𝑡 ℎ𝑒 ℎ𝑎𝑑 𝑜𝑛𝑙𝑦 𝑠𝑝𝑜𝑘𝑒𝑛 𝑡𝑜 𝑎𝑏𝑜𝑢𝑡 “15-20 𝑝𝑒𝑜𝑝𝑙𝑒 𝑖𝑛 𝑂𝑘𝑙𝑎ℎ𝑜𝑚𝑎’𝑠 𝐽𝑒𝑤𝑖𝑠ℎ 𝑐𝑜𝑚𝑚𝑢𝑛𝑖𝑡𝑦, 𝑤𝑖𝑡ℎ 𝑏𝑜𝑡ℎ 𝑡ℎ𝑒 𝑂𝑘𝑙𝑎ℎ𝑜𝑚𝑎 𝐶𝑖𝑡𝑦 𝑎𝑛𝑑 𝑇𝑢𝑙𝑠𝑎 𝐽𝑒𝑤𝑖𝑠ℎ 𝑐𝑜𝑚𝑚𝑢𝑛𝑖𝑡𝑖𝑒𝑠 𝑜𝑛 𝑟𝑒𝑐𝑜𝑟𝑑 𝑜𝑝𝑝𝑜𝑠𝑖𝑛𝑔 𝑡ℎ𝑒 𝑠𝑐ℎ𝑜𝑜𝑙”?
That should have been his first hint to drip the whole thing. If the community you claim to serve tells you they don't want you to, it's time to consider what the real reason you're there is.
Can you say evangelical Trojan Horse? I knew you could.
OT:
https://www.advocate.com/news/religion/mormon-church-transgender-members-rituals
Mor(m)ons didn't want black people in their priesthood or doing temple stuff until 1978 when the LDS (via their President Spencer W. Kimball) suddenly received a "revelation" after 148 years.
Bet it had something to with ongoing protests and boycotts, not to mention legal issues. Not compassion or received wisdom.
They realized that they were missing out on that 10% of the income black people earned.
Bingo!
So the Mormon hierarchy are a bunch of asshats. This is news?
Just another group trying to marginalize trans people.
This reminds me of the time I turned in a literal pile of shit for my American History essay. Sure it obvious had a bunch of flaws, like it was literally a pile of shit, instead of a 10,000 word essay on how the corruption of the political corruption of the early twenty century effected the response to great depression, and I understand why it got a failing grade. But since, Mr. Cooligen didn't describe why each peanut embedded in the shit deserves a failing grade, I demand it be regraded!
You needed to chew your food better.
Yet another great reason to keep religion out of education.
The reality here is that we have a group of religious people who want to take taxpayer dollars for themselves and leave the taxpayer holding the bag. It's theft - outright stealing - and it's a shame it doesn't get called that more often. Kudos to Mr. Drummond for holding the school board's feet to that fire, would that we had more AGs willing to pursue these matters.
I am... genuinely surprised to see something this clever, and this seemingly well-intentioned, coming out of a red state AG. I don't get to put on my 𝘩𝘰𝘯𝘦𝘴𝘵𝘭𝘺 shocked face very often around here, but... hey, lookit that, it still fits! Bit dusty. Should've at least cleaned it more often.
I will spare my sanity by not looking into the rest of this guy's record, and pretend for 𝘫𝘶𝘴𝘵 𝘢 𝘮𝘰𝘮𝘦𝘯𝘵 that he might be one of those vanishingly rare Republicans with more than just vestigial senses of professional ethics and civic responsibility.
Best not to look. It’s like people praising Tucker Carlson for his views on the war and forgetting all about his “Great Replacement” theory here at home.
Gosh, I wonder what they’re trying to do. Using one of the board members of the Catholic charter school to get this Jewish school to be approved. How magnanimous of him.
Anything to kick off Armageddon soonest.
I'm ready.
Dust off your Bakker buckets.
https://i.makeagif.com/media/1-13-2017/J-iO1_.gif
Well, the raptor was a bust yesterday.
If the religious zealots can’t wring money from the public for their indoctrination, then they’ll waste it on lawsuits. I suppose they consider that a win-win because it never seems to end. 🙄
I agree with Jesse on this:
https://quotefancy.com/media/wallpaper/3840x2160/764714-Jesse-Ventura-Quote-Organized-religion-is-a-sham-and-a-crutch-for.jpg
Religious education must be one of the BIGGEST oxymoron out there! Half the time these religious schools don’t teach the proper educational curriculum, but teach outside the rules such as creationism in science class, Bible as actual history, etc. so the students are unable to cope with the modern world, and the only job they can get includes the phrase “Do you want fries with that?”.