Organized religion is more about going by the rules than morality. This fool demonstrates the disconnect between religion and morality once again, as if we needed another example of it. One of the worst characteristics of racists is their tendency to be so proud of their bigotry.
Didn't Jeebus spend all of his time hiking between all those places in Judea and Galilee? I'll bet he was 'brown as a berry'. It has been pointed out repeatedly that if Jeebus actually existed and 'came back" - modern white christians would lynch him in a hot second.
It's been decades, because there just aren't enough priests. (A lot of principles die when encountered with reality.)
Reminds me of our village, when it came to the question of girls becoming altar boys. The pope was against it, some other folks were against it (proclaiming very loudly, as I remember) and a couple of years later most of the altar boys were girls. Without the girls there would have been no altar boys.
(Apologies, it feels awful writing 'altar boys', is there a gender neutral phrase for the young people who are doing all the running and fetching during mass?)
I stopped being an altar boy (and a believer) when I was still a child. All the changes came after I departed from Holy Mother Church. But you know how it is. You see and you hear about things like this.
This has just made me remember my mother. She was rather conservative, small c conservative, just imagine a middle-aged housewife, involved in all kinds of things and events which made/makes a village.
I can remember chatting to her and she was in favour of girls being altar servers. Some years later we talked again and she was in favour of priests marrying. And later still in another conversation she expressed that she was in favour of women priests.
On all of these occasions I was surprised by her opinions, I had thought that her conservatism would have been stronger.
Even in the low church United Methodist Church lay people could distribute the bread and juice (never crackers in churches I served) but it had to be CONSECRATED by me. Since I was an ordained elder, I had the power to do the magic!
My father was a lifelong Lutheran Missouri Synod minister. His churches were never more than ~300 congregants and he did everything himself. One time he realized he was low on the proper wine so he subbed in his homemade elderberry vino. He was quite proud that almost no one noticed.
“The Church pushes a variety of awful views—it’s anti-abortion, anti-LGBTQ rights, anti-trans, anti-birth control—but outright racism isn’t one of them.”
Sure outright racism isn’t one of them, but it’s very much still there underneath it all. The religious Right decided decades ago that it was more palatable to be outright misogynistic and anti-LGBTQ and now we live in an ever growing authoritarian state.
Well, you can’t be a colonizer without a heaping dose of racism. Missionaries can’t bring the lard to the unwashed masses if they can’t determine who those unwashed masses are without a quick look at them. Plus most of the witch hunts were racially motivated.
I only half-agree with you. You are right that the catholic church has got an awful lot of awful views and you are correct naming them.
When it comes to racism, the picture is more nuanced: The official catholic church has been rather protective of refugees. Popes Leo and Francis were supportive of eg Palestinians and the American catholic church castigated ICE for not allowing priests to deliver pastoral care and the eucharist to detainees.
Yes, there are some catholics who are as right wing as the white evangelical nationalists, but many still seem to remember the social teaching of Jesus. You know the bit about healing the sick, feeding the hungry, and looking after strangers.
I understand what you are saying, but I just don’t buy it coming from the Catholic Church. Looking at their history in the Americas and also at the corrupt Catholics currently in our Supreme Court. Also race, gender, and class are interconnected issues. It’s hard to believe anything is authentic when parts of that are ignored. I’m also looking at this from a USA perspective of what I’ve being seeing/experiencing vs what is publicly stated or what ambitions they have. Will it take another 500 years for them to stop dehumanizing women and the queer community? No one has that kind of time to waste.
“What good is a moral country club if it admits guys like these as members?”
I wanted to highlight this fantastic takedown of the church.
I also wanted to mention that, like all country clubs, church claims superiority (in morality) while in reality being the lowest common denominator. So, country clubs espouse class and sophistication and claims they high standards of behavior, their members only put on airs when visible from the outside and the clubs tend to hide the worst behaviors of society. I mean, Mar A Lago is a country club and they ran a child sex trafficking operation out of their spa. Every single Trump golf club allows him to cheat, poorly, and praises every clumsy, bumbling swing.
With churches*, they claim moral superiority while preaching guilt, hatred, punishment, and obedience, none of which have any moral value. Then there’s the scandals, child molestation, child marriage, abuse of women (Magdalene Laundry, witch hunts and burnings, complimentarianism, etc.), missionary colonialism, residential schools, fraud, theft, propping up some of history’s worst dictators, and so on. Then they’re wield forgiveness like a weapon, abusing the victims of their crimes and their congregations’ crimes a second time. So, just like country clubs, they present greatness while being the worst scum on the planet, and therefore, Mikey here fits right in, he might just not be in the correct sect for his particular “sin”.
*All sects, and while some are better than others in different issues, they all have their problems.
Church doctrine didn't condemn racism when I was trapped in...er…attending a Catholic indoctrination center...um…elementary school. Nuns routinely lectured us on why we should not have non-Catholic friends (they'll lead us to heresy and hell) and never, ever play with black childten (they'll steal our toys and bicycles). That school was 100% white, and it wasn't until I was an adult that I found out that they had a clever way of denying entrance to families of undesirable ethnicity. It was a parish in a strongly Polish neighborhood - it was Saint Mary of Czestochowa (their 10:00 Sunday Mass featured a Polish language sermon) - and whenever a family that wasn't lily white wanted to enroll a child, they were told that fluency in Polish was required because they had bilingual education. Well, that was true at one time; however, the Polish language instruction was discontinued in 1921 but continued to be used an a basis for excluding non-white students into the 1970s.
The parish of Saint Mary of Czestochowa no longer exists. The school was taken over by another Catholic agency and has a racially mixed student body. The church has been deconsecrated and houses a school of robotics and the convent was torn down a long time ago.
As if the Eucharist is sterile. Never mind that everyone else has mentioned that the most likely culprit of not washing after using the bathroom are white men, these things sit out after being blessed in a roomful of people singing, coughing, sneezing, talking, and losing skin cells, and hair. And there’s no way to racist yourself out of consuming that Indian lady’s molecular existence. But sure, you are a big hero because you won’t accept her giving it to you directly.
Organized religion is more about going by the rules than morality. This fool demonstrates the disconnect between religion and morality once again, as if we needed another example of it. One of the worst characteristics of racists is their tendency to be so proud of their bigotry.
I grew up in rural Iowa. There were plenty of racists and you are correct that they were proud of it.
Pretty much everywhere in Iowa is rural. 🙂
I know. I grew up literally six miles from the nearest paved road.
Gravel is a form of paving. 😉
Where in Iowa? My mom was from Missouri Valley, north of Omaha.
About 50 miles west of Iowa City. Iowa County.
Hey Mikey...
Just what skin tone do you think a 1st Century Palestinian Jew like your Jesus had?
That's an easy question, haven't you seen the photos? He was tall, handsome, blond with blue eyes ....
Photos? More like paintings. I don't think they had silver nitrate 2000 years ago, or decent lenses, for that matter! 😁
I know. It was a joke. Or more like an attempt at a joke.
Do you think having some coffee rather than another cup of tea would help?
:-)
Hemant is up and at it on a weekend!
And an hour early!
*grumblegrumblegrumble*
Up and at them, Fallout Boy!
[𝐻]𝑒 𝑠𝑒𝑒𝑚𝑠 𝑡𝑜 𝑢𝑛𝑑𝑒𝑟𝑠𝑡𝑎𝑛𝑑 𝑡ℎ𝑒 𝑑𝑖𝑓𝑓𝑒𝑟𝑒𝑛𝑐𝑒 𝑏𝑒𝑡𝑤𝑒𝑒𝑛 𝑟𝑖𝑔ℎ𝑡 𝑎𝑛𝑑 𝑤𝑟𝑜𝑛𝑔. 𝐻𝑒 𝑗𝑢𝑠𝑡 𝑑𝑜𝑒𝑠𝑛’𝑡 𝑐𝑎𝑟𝑒. 𝑁𝑜𝑡ℎ𝑖𝑛𝑔 𝑎𝑏𝑜𝑢𝑡 ℎ𝑖𝑠 𝑟𝑒𝑙𝑖𝑔𝑖𝑜𝑛 𝑡𝑎𝑢𝑔ℎ𝑡 ℎ𝑖𝑚 𝑡ℎ𝑎𝑡 ℎ𝑒 𝑠ℎ𝑜𝑢𝑙𝑑 𝑐ℎ𝑜𝑜𝑠𝑒 𝑡ℎ𝑒 𝑚𝑜𝑟𝑎𝑙 𝑝𝑎𝑡ℎ.
Surprise, surprise. Christianity doesn't provide real moral guidance. I am shocked. Well, not that shocked.
If you need a god to tell you right from wrong, you are just a psychopath on a leash. This particular psychopath seems to enjoy slipping his leash.
Well, Mike is OBVIOUSLY not a Real Christian.
Didn't Jeebus spend all of his time hiking between all those places in Judea and Galilee? I'll bet he was 'brown as a berry'. It has been pointed out repeatedly that if Jeebus actually existed and 'came back" - modern white christians would lynch him in a hot second.
It's been said there are no white people in the Bible. Some of the Romans may have been, but not the Middle-Eastern Jews.
All the whites are in the translation, editorial, and publishers' suites.
He's a 𝗡𝗼 𝗧𝗿𝘂𝗲 𝗖𝗵𝗿𝗶𝘀𝘁𝗶𝗮𝗻™
I did not realize that the RCC permitted women to distribute the crackers. I thought that was a priest only thing.
It's been decades, because there just aren't enough priests. (A lot of principles die when encountered with reality.)
Reminds me of our village, when it came to the question of girls becoming altar boys. The pope was against it, some other folks were against it (proclaiming very loudly, as I remember) and a couple of years later most of the altar boys were girls. Without the girls there would have been no altar boys.
(Apologies, it feels awful writing 'altar boys', is there a gender neutral phrase for the young people who are doing all the running and fetching during mass?)
Alter minions? Victims?
More like servants, or more likely prey!
Your spelling of "altar" is quite appropriate
Eucharist assistants?
Customer service?
“Assistants” is so 2010s. Surely you mean “Eucharist para-professional”.
Potential prey.
I was guessing it had to do with a priest shortage but had no idea it had been going on for decades. Thanks for explanation.
Altar servers/Mass servers (I was one back before altar boys went coed and they started introducing girls and eventually adults).
I like altar servers. I'll use it in future.
Question - how did the switch to co-ed go in your place? I'd be interested to hear, if you've got the time to write a response?
Thankyou.
I stopped being an altar boy (and a believer) when I was still a child. All the changes came after I departed from Holy Mother Church. But you know how it is. You see and you hear about things like this.
Thank you.
This has just made me remember my mother. She was rather conservative, small c conservative, just imagine a middle-aged housewife, involved in all kinds of things and events which made/makes a village.
I can remember chatting to her and she was in favour of girls being altar servers. Some years later we talked again and she was in favour of priests marrying. And later still in another conversation she expressed that she was in favour of women priests.
On all of these occasions I was surprised by her opinions, I had thought that her conservatism would have been stronger.
I could say altar serfs/slaves!
That church that's okay with him pays no taxes. None of them do. I wonder how many pedos this particular one is protecting.
We called them acolytes in the Lutheran and Methodist Churches.
Laypeople, known as “Extraordinary Ministers”, have been distributing the Eucharist for decades.
Thanks.
Even in the low church United Methodist Church lay people could distribute the bread and juice (never crackers in churches I served) but it had to be CONSECRATED by me. Since I was an ordained elder, I had the power to do the magic!
My father was a lifelong Lutheran Missouri Synod minister. His churches were never more than ~300 congregants and he did everything himself. One time he realized he was low on the proper wine so he subbed in his homemade elderberry vino. He was quite proud that almost no one noticed.
“The Church pushes a variety of awful views—it’s anti-abortion, anti-LGBTQ rights, anti-trans, anti-birth control—but outright racism isn’t one of them.”
Sure outright racism isn’t one of them, but it’s very much still there underneath it all. The religious Right decided decades ago that it was more palatable to be outright misogynistic and anti-LGBTQ and now we live in an ever growing authoritarian state.
Another woman died recently due to abortion bans.
https://www.propublica.org/article/north-carolina-abortion-laws-ciji-graham
Well, you can’t be a colonizer without a heaping dose of racism. Missionaries can’t bring the lard to the unwashed masses if they can’t determine who those unwashed masses are without a quick look at them. Plus most of the witch hunts were racially motivated.
💯
I only half-agree with you. You are right that the catholic church has got an awful lot of awful views and you are correct naming them.
When it comes to racism, the picture is more nuanced: The official catholic church has been rather protective of refugees. Popes Leo and Francis were supportive of eg Palestinians and the American catholic church castigated ICE for not allowing priests to deliver pastoral care and the eucharist to detainees.
Yes, there are some catholics who are as right wing as the white evangelical nationalists, but many still seem to remember the social teaching of Jesus. You know the bit about healing the sick, feeding the hungry, and looking after strangers.
I understand what you are saying, but I just don’t buy it coming from the Catholic Church. Looking at their history in the Americas and also at the corrupt Catholics currently in our Supreme Court. Also race, gender, and class are interconnected issues. It’s hard to believe anything is authentic when parts of that are ignored. I’m also looking at this from a USA perspective of what I’ve being seeing/experiencing vs what is publicly stated or what ambitions they have. Will it take another 500 years for them to stop dehumanizing women and the queer community? No one has that kind of time to waste.
Dude, have you ever been in a crowded public men's room? Do you know w
How many white guys don't wash their hands? And I will say the only people I have ever seen go from the stall directly to the door are white dudes.
Mike is full of fecal matter.
Mike is fecal matter.
“What good is a moral country club if it admits guys like these as members?”
I wanted to highlight this fantastic takedown of the church.
I also wanted to mention that, like all country clubs, church claims superiority (in morality) while in reality being the lowest common denominator. So, country clubs espouse class and sophistication and claims they high standards of behavior, their members only put on airs when visible from the outside and the clubs tend to hide the worst behaviors of society. I mean, Mar A Lago is a country club and they ran a child sex trafficking operation out of their spa. Every single Trump golf club allows him to cheat, poorly, and praises every clumsy, bumbling swing.
With churches*, they claim moral superiority while preaching guilt, hatred, punishment, and obedience, none of which have any moral value. Then there’s the scandals, child molestation, child marriage, abuse of women (Magdalene Laundry, witch hunts and burnings, complimentarianism, etc.), missionary colonialism, residential schools, fraud, theft, propping up some of history’s worst dictators, and so on. Then they’re wield forgiveness like a weapon, abusing the victims of their crimes and their congregations’ crimes a second time. So, just like country clubs, they present greatness while being the worst scum on the planet, and therefore, Mikey here fits right in, he might just not be in the correct sect for his particular “sin”.
*All sects, and while some are better than others in different issues, they all have their problems.
Church doctrine didn't condemn racism when I was trapped in...er…attending a Catholic indoctrination center...um…elementary school. Nuns routinely lectured us on why we should not have non-Catholic friends (they'll lead us to heresy and hell) and never, ever play with black childten (they'll steal our toys and bicycles). That school was 100% white, and it wasn't until I was an adult that I found out that they had a clever way of denying entrance to families of undesirable ethnicity. It was a parish in a strongly Polish neighborhood - it was Saint Mary of Czestochowa (their 10:00 Sunday Mass featured a Polish language sermon) - and whenever a family that wasn't lily white wanted to enroll a child, they were told that fluency in Polish was required because they had bilingual education. Well, that was true at one time; however, the Polish language instruction was discontinued in 1921 but continued to be used an a basis for excluding non-white students into the 1970s.
The parish of Saint Mary of Czestochowa no longer exists. The school was taken over by another Catholic agency and has a racially mixed student body. The church has been deconsecrated and houses a school of robotics and the convent was torn down a long time ago.
Fecal matter, Mikey? Might want to look up the incidents of holy water tainted by fecal matter.
Gonna blame that on non-whites?
Probably.
But what does it say about his faith, I wonder, that he doesn't think his god can protect him from a few measly little molecules of poo?
As if the Eucharist is sterile. Never mind that everyone else has mentioned that the most likely culprit of not washing after using the bathroom are white men, these things sit out after being blessed in a roomful of people singing, coughing, sneezing, talking, and losing skin cells, and hair. And there’s no way to racist yourself out of consuming that Indian lady’s molecular existence. But sure, you are a big hero because you won’t accept her giving it to you directly.
"Considering what’s happening in the U.S. and in the world with our replacement."
If only his replacement was here and he was gone....................................
Do you know how it is now. His replacement would probably be a cheap plastic imitation.
I wonder if he would accept the cracker at communion from Pete hegseth? You remember - he of the unwashed hands for multiple years?
Ewww...
First: Religion is the root of all evil
Second: Catholic = Groyper ( seems right)
Third: Catholic = Conflicted ( this guy is the poster boy for conflicted)
Just another creepy white boy who thinks we even give a fuck what he thinks or does.